Deer herd Management

[polarnut]

Question is how many bucks are too many to take from a 250 acre hunting property with crop management? The property borders other farm properties and is typical of rural CNY area. A nice 7, two nice 6's and a scrub 5 taken already, and another 5 if you count the one shot 20yds off the property by a neighboring hunter and then killed by one our our hunters. We hunt 4 people on this property. No Doe taken yet.

I hope to spark some interest here as I would love to here from you on this subject.

Thank You,

[dogdoc]

Every situation is a little different. All depends on your deer population. Do you know the age of the bucks taken? My bet if that many bucks have already been taken then there are plenty of does on your hunting property. If this is a hunting club then you might want to talk about an age restriction. There is really no need to take younger bucks if there are plenty of does (except for kids). If your only shooting 3.5 year plus bucks you will probably see a decrease in the number of bucks killed.

[wtnhunt]

Really think it depends. Deer density and buck to doe ratios would be numbers to look at. Also would be important to consider other properties around you and how many they are taking. Some areas where there is a lot of transitioning deer traffic taking 5 bucks off 250 acres might be no big deal.

[polarnut]

Thanks Wtnjunt, that is what we are thinking, the deer are moving in and out all the time, so we believe it too depends on the doe Population. we are seeing some big healthy does, but not as many as we would like to see, but again they move in and out all the time.

As for Dogdocs comments, if we tried to manage age harvesting, are neighbors do not and wont, they shoot anything that moves, so really its no feasible.

[whitetailfreak55]

Think of it this way polarnut, if you shoot a younger deer that deer is 100% dead if you let him walk he has a chance of making it. Good luck!

[wtnhunt]

As for Dogdocs comments, if we tried to manage age harvesting, are neighbors do not and wont, they shoot anything that moves, so really its no feasible.

Comes down to what your goals are when working on your management plan. We dealt with the same for years(neighbors with the brown its down mentality) and we are allowed 3 bucks a year. I still passed up a lot of deer knowing they would likely get shot on the neighboring properties or by poachers, we only have 60 acres. It can be very frustrating, but when you pass the little ones, some might make it.

[redkneck]

Think of it this way polarnut, if you shoot a younger deer that deer is 100% dead if you let him walk he has a chance of making it. Good luck!

Yep. A few will make it. All about what your goals are and deer density, and movement as stated above.

[polarnut]

Thanks all-is exactly what i did again this morning-4 does came brousing at 7:00Am one wasnt interested in eating-she was hot and went off on her own. Half hour later a young 4PT came along on her trail and away he went after her, after i let himr go of course. Still waiting on the mature buck!

[dogdoc]

what you really need to do is set up a good camera survey starting mid summer. I'd probably set up 4 cameras though out your land. Bait (if legal) with corn and a mineral block. That way you can get a pretty good count of how many bucks you have using your land. Of course this could change a little when the bachelor groups break up but at least it will give you a baseline. You can check out Watch Deer Hunting Videos. Free. GrowingDeer.tv and check out all the videos by Dr. Grant Woods. He has several that explain how to use game cameras to access your deer herd and numbers.

todd

[PotashRLS]

"Deer Herd Management" starts with the doe. She is the target animal when controlling population. Taking bucks does very little to affect herd numbers. While not always palatable, doe fawns during the end of the season are good targets too as they eat for free all year taking nutrition out of the mouths of the deer you want to keep.

[dbHunterNY]

if your population is suitable for the areas holding capacity or I suppose you think there's enough deer around given food, cover, and all that during the winter months. then you need to do a survey like said during the summer months into the fall. how many fawns are you seeing that will replace the deer your taking in fall? I like to take a total number of deer equal to 2/3 that number. why only 2/3? other deer will get shot by neighbors, eaten by predators, hit by cars, etc. on top of that I like to take equal number of doe to bucks at the least. that way your buck to doe ratio is working toward 1:1, which leads to benefits and a whole other topic. that's what I think and try to do.

[wtnhunt]

Situations are different for sure, a good survey would be very valuable in establishing a plan. Predation here some years takes its toll and then too we have had dramatic dieoffs from ehd. Years when numbers are down it would not be real wise to overkill your does. You have to have enough to keep a balance. Keeping a decent buck to doe ratio is important. Would be worth talking to your state biologist to find out about the carrying capacity in your area and find out about densities and plan your goals out from your surveys and the data available to you.

[Ravin R10 man]

Polar, the only buck I feel was right in taking out is the scrub 5, otherwise, if this is a crop tag deal, the does need to be thinned, most bucks will not even show you the potential they have until 3.5 bottom line, too many young bucks are being taken of a relatively small area.

[polarnut]

to all: thanks all and everyones input is valuable and warrants consideration. XT man, if we could control neighbors, i like your idea. We will (the 4 of us) look over everyone's input and maybe call the biologist, all great inputs from some very seasoned hunters. Thank You, by all means keep it going

[hoosierhunter]

Deer herd Management

Straight answer.....

5 bucks is way too many to harvest off of 250 acres if your trying to have any reasonable management practices. The other major problem I have is 0 does. If your numbers are low then 5 bucks is unreasonable, if you have too many then 0 does is unreasonable. I'm very curious as to why this approach was taken.

As for having poor neighbors as a reason to not let bucks walk... Well that's just an excuse to shoot a deer IMO. If you have 250 acres, then you can hold deer. It's more about being disciplined with yourself than anything your neighbors do. It sounds to me that you do not really have any substantial policies and procedures in place to manage this land. It sounds more about what strikes your fancy that particular day. There's nothing wrong with that but you need to make a decision on what you want to accomplish with this ground.

[Ravin R10 man]

agree with pat..you need to have an area you do not enter a sanctuary/bedding area...and establish some food plots to hold them best you can

[smha6784]

Deer herd Management

Agree with Hoosier and Mathews. Too many young bucks taken off 250 AC. Zero does = zero management. With out a good trail cam survey to back up deer density numbers and buck to doe ratio. You guys cannot really determine how to begin managing property. I learned a lot about managing deer herds from this site and QDMA, they have tons of info on there as that is what they do. And yes 250 AC will hold deer as long as there's plenty food and not too much hunting pressure.

[Ravin R10 man]

agree with pat..you need to have an area you do not enter a sanctuary/bedding area...and establish some food plots to hold them best you can

The other thing you need to do is establish a base line for bucks that CAN be shot, and the ones to be left alone to grow

[Buttinhead]

Don't shoot does if your goal is to harvest more and bigger bucks. An outfitter exists that has great success harvesting the neighbors bucks by not shooting any does. Pretty solid hunt model if you ask me!

"Doe management at Snipe Creek; the College Sorority houses of the animal kingdom. NO WE DO NOT SHOOT DOES. WE LOVE OUR DOES and particularly the neighboring bucks appreciate the Snipe Creek sorority houses; WISH WE HAD MORE HOT GIRLS. The carrying capacity, of the Snipe Creek hunt zones, is beyond having a doe problem. The doe problem that potentially exists, is the fact that more does are required in some hunt / habitat zones..."

[RangerClay]

Hey there fellow New Yorker! I too hunt central New York. Where do you hunt?

[dbHunterNY]

old original post I wonder if he's still around. I've learned a great deal more since I posted.