dbHunterNY Posted March 19, 2014 Report Share Posted March 19, 2014 Neighbors and my family were invited to a Q&A session that is going to be held at a local deer processor down the road. Not exactly sure what will become of it. Hopefully we can all agree to some guidelines and there won't be excuses and BS theories that I have to plead my case against. for example spikes aren't inferior genetics, you can't determine a bucks age by counting points and dividing by 2, and just because we don't have black dirt like some areas of the Midwest doesn't mean we can't have good heavy healthy deer. those are just a few mindsets I've had to contend with. I'm not beyond anything though and will be asking questions too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted March 19, 2014 Report Share Posted March 19, 2014 Neighbors and I are meeting with some from QDMA Good luck with it. Would be nice if we could get cooperation out of some of the property owners around us. Wish we could get some of them to understand management. Few leased properties and poachers also make it tough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoosierhunter Posted March 20, 2014 Report Share Posted March 20, 2014 The important part is that you are having the meeting. Just starting the discussion is half the battle. Even if one landowner changes his views it's a success. Some guys will be adamantly against it and chances are you won't change their mind. My focus would be the guys who don't say much because that usually means they are at least evaluating what everyone has to say and thinking about it. My thought has been if I can get guys to at least think while on stand that can be the difference between hesitation and that young buck not presenting a shot later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoosierhunter Posted March 20, 2014 Report Share Posted March 20, 2014 Take notes of who attends and try reaching out to the on the fence guys within a week or two of the meeting. Inevitably they will have questions they don't want to voice in front of everyone. It's your opportunity to be the voice of reason to their questions. Make sure the initial goals are small achievable steps. The biggest mistake I see people make is pushing for unattainable commitment. IE shooting only 4.5 year olds immediately. I'd you start with educating them on how to age deer on the hoof. Maybe bring some trail cam photos along to share. Show people the jump deer make from 1.5 to 2.5 and 2.5 to 3.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbHunterNY Posted March 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2014 so I went to the meeting last night. I thought it went very well. it was basically just what I thought it'd be.... a special requested land owner meeting to possibly start a new QDM co-op. Upper Hudson Valley QDMA members were there as well as those who've had their own co-ops in the area or neighboring county for a handful of years now. QDMA Biologist Matt Ross was there and I thought did an awesome job, especially in comparing apples to apples with the situation that we in the immediate area faced. many area farmer/land owners showed up and left with a good attitude. some didn't and some left early but I'm keeping hopes up that they are still willing. basically everybody said I'm willing to do it if everybody else does and nobody out right said I don't agree. some weren't even hunters but just land owners. there's no reason this shouldn't happen and get started. we added up the acreage and it was well over 1,000 with most being contiguous which is recommended but isn't really a requirement. I even got some verification that rules I've come up with for my parents house are the right direction and now I'm thinking others will take them a little more serious. the co-op video that Matt showed with Kip basically said the first meeting wasn't to start one and instead be exposed to the idea. within 2 months I'm thinking we will definitely have another and try to form a co-op. I wasn't the one that started this despite I should've been but I will be one trying to keep the ball rolling down the court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbHunterNY Posted March 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2014 Take notes of who attends and try reaching out to the on the fence guys within a week or two of the meeting. Inevitably they will have questions they don't want to voice in front of everyone. It's your opportunity to be the voice of reason to their questions. Make sure the initial goals are small achievable steps. The biggest mistake I see people make is pushing for unattainable commitment. IE shooting only 4.5 year olds immediately. I'd you start with educating them on how to age deer on the hoof. Maybe bring some trail cam photos along to share. Show people the jump deer make from 1.5 to 2.5 and 2.5 to 3.5. it would all depend on what the land owners agree to after the co-op gets started. however, I think a good start will be 3 points to a side (brow tines included) and a 14" spread. then once that sticks education on age class will follow enough to protect 2.5 year olds. from there we'd be doing good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogdoc Posted March 22, 2014 Report Share Posted March 22, 2014 hey--that's a great start. every little bit helps. i hope the progress continues--could be the start of something really good. good luck todd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravin R10 man Posted March 22, 2014 Report Share Posted March 22, 2014 We had a guy buy half a section across from my Dads (450) acres...held a QDMA meeting, all hyped up to feed deer let 'em go let 'em grow etc.. we've been doing that for ten years before he came in, we shot all the scrub horn in bred junk, fed all winter, every winter...pretty soon he is shooting anything that walks, we found deer with arrows /marginal shots laying dead, found out his kids had friends over...stands all over the place...then he gets upset because we shot good bucks, they never saw them, only on cam and nocturnal. Good luck hope it turns out for you all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbHunterNY Posted March 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2014 We had a guy buy half a section across from my Dads (450) acres...held a QDMA meeting, all hyped up to feed deer let 'em go let 'em grow etc.. we've been doing that for ten years before he came in, we shot all the scrub horn in bred junk, fed all winter, every winter...pretty soon he is shooting anything that walks, we found deer with arrows /marginal shots laying dead, found out his kids had friends over...stands all over the place...then he gets upset because we shot good bucks, they never saw them, only on cam and nocturnal. Good luck hope it turns out for you all. 450 acres won't do too much without neighbors doing something similar to whatever it is you're doing. we've got almost that now. many co-ops multiple landowners together fail even with thousands. they definitely can be successful though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravin R10 man Posted March 24, 2014 Report Share Posted March 24, 2014 He had 240 db...that's nearly 700 acres..guy north of us had about the same, up to 1000 acres north guy did what you are supposed to, it was the guy east of us , 240 a,that came in all cranked up about QDMA, then didn't follow his own rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbHunterNY Posted March 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2014 lol.... yea we were warned at the meeting that some will do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted March 24, 2014 Report Share Posted March 24, 2014 Yep, expect to have some flat out lie to you and talk a good game. It is unfortunate reality some will tell you they are gonna let the little ones walk, but will shoot every deer that they see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravin R10 man Posted March 25, 2014 Report Share Posted March 25, 2014 it's tough to change your mindset if killing any buck is your goal, plus like the guy I was talking about, did not really know much about hunting, stand placement, hunting the wind etc. when they hit the woods the deer came running off the piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted March 25, 2014 Report Share Posted March 25, 2014 it's tough to change your mindset if killing any buck is your goal, plus like the guy I was talking about, Honestly think it is a matter of lack of self control for many. Plenty around this area who been hunting their entire lives that will not let anything walk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoosierhunter Posted March 25, 2014 Report Share Posted March 25, 2014 Completely lack of self control. It's ok to shoot anything as long as you have NEVER complained about your deer hunting situation. 90% of hunters should just look in the mirror when searching for the problem. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbHunterNY Posted March 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 we were told that what the other co-ops have found out is this. say one person is set in there ways and just stubborn beyond belief. you should simply continue your efforts to educate others but continue to include the person in things and results. many times if that person chooses to accept what you're doing they end up being your loudest supporter. if they don't change then you're no worse off than you were anyway. it's important not to bash them but be positive. pat didn't you have a neighbor that started coming around by asking you about what you're doing and how you're improving your hunting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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