Why not feed the deer?

[johnf]

I was a little suprised that the percentage of people who didn't think baiting deer should be legal. If you don't think it should be, could you explain why?

[jerdanmagic]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

My deer are corn fed and corn bread!!!!!

[Doc]

Re: Why not feed the deer? *DELETED*

Post deleted by Doc

[TreeStandBowHunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I Don't think baiting deer should be legal because that's like hunting them out of a zoo. Now if you happen to hunt them over food plots and farm and crops or whatever, then I don't consider that baiting. Baiting to me is throwing corn or apples,etc under your treestand or putting a salt block under your treestand. JMO

[dogdoc]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

[ QUOTE ]

I Don't think baiting deer should be legal because that's like hunting them out of a zoo.

[/ QUOTE ]

Trust me--nothing like hunting at the zoo. A lot of TV hunting shows show deer swarming to bait piles---it's not like that in the real world--at least not in my area.

If it's legal in your state I have no problem with it at all.

todd

[Shaun_300]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

Its illegal in Ontario to bait deer. i am all for that. i dont think that it should be legal because like Mike said, its like hunting at a zoo. i like feeding them in the off-season, but i'm not really a fan of baiting them when you're hunting. JMO.

[Doc]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I just deleted my last reply, because I mis-read the original post. The title didn't agree with the message and I responded to the title.

As far as baiting is concerned, I would be opposed to it being legalized here in NY. Where it is currently legal, that is their business and in some states there are very legitimate reasons for allowing it.

Here in NY, there is no need to treat our deer like some Pavlovian experiment. I don't believe that there is really any justification for trying to train our deer to come to a specific, pre-measured shot location. When I get that desparate to get a deer, then I suppose it will be time to quit. Baiting is not necessarily a guaranteed situation, but it can be. And in some situations can reduce hunting to the same level as shooting domestic animals at a feeding trough.

Now I know there are some who will try to muddy this discussion by comparing baiting to food plots. Forget it! there is no way that you can compare training deer to come to some pre-designated exact spot vs. drawing them to the entire perimeter of a field. Don't even go there. It's not that I am some big fan of food plots for hunting, but that doesn't even belong in the same discussion as baiting.

Frankly, I am getting a bit tired of reading about all these various schemes to treat our wild deer herd as some kind of farm commodity in the name of hunting. That sort of activity in no way represents anything to do with hunting in my mind. people who have commercial deer farms do not call the slaughtering time a hunt, and there really is no reason for us hunters to start treating hunting like slaughtering livestock.

Perhaps it is time to re-evaluate exactly why we are out there hunting in the first place instead of hanging out at the local meat market. I could be wrong, but I don't think we really want a wild deer herd that comes running to the sound of a timed feeder going off. Is that hunting?

I realize that not every baiting mechanism works flawlessly, and that there are no real guarantees that baiting will always work, but I have read enough articles to understand that occasionally it does work out to be a guaranteed situation. I also assume that those who attempt baiting are certainly hoping that it will work out that way or they wouldn't be investing the money in the feed or the mechanisms to disperse it. It's that mindset that makes me question whether hunter mentalities have arrived at the "deer at any cost" attitudes. It's the kind of thing that makes internet hunting all of a sudden pop up on the market.

I think it is good to occasionally question just why you are hunting and exactly what does hunting mean to you personally. I believe that if more people did that, there probably wouldn't be any discussions about baiting.

Doc

[craig mack]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I see nothing wrong with baiting. And yes Doc I think hunting over a bait pile and hunting over a small food plot as the same thing. Your hunting over a food source that was put there by man.

[Tony]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

here we go again..

havent we been down this road enough already ...

[buckee]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I don't see anything wrong with baiting, even though it's not really for me.

It gives those, who may not be the greatest hunters, or a limited time schedule an opportunity to bag a deer.

Actually baiting isn't all it's cracked up to be. You'll find that those smart old does and bucks will chose to go to bait piles in the moon-light rather than the daylight, for the most part.

Mineral blocks are great for keeping deer healthy in the winter time and good for antler growth too.

[johnf]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

[ QUOTE ]

I Don't think baiting deer should be legal because that's like hunting them out of a zoo. Now if you happen to hunt them over food plots and farm and crops or whatever, then I don't consider that baiting. Baiting to me is throwing corn or apples,etc under your treestand or putting a salt block under your treestand. JMO

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really like that around here. The area tht I hunt has a lot of pochers and illigal dog hunting. I have gone weeks without seeing a deer at a feeder during the day. The reason I use them is just to keep deer in the area. Most of the hunting I did this year was not in sight of a feeder. I just use them to keep the deer coming back after being run off by the dogs.

BTW: I have never shot at a deer while it was at, coming to or leaving a feeder. It is simply used as a centralized food source on the land I hunt.

To me this isn't any different then using a food plot. Sorry, jmho.

jf

[ThethirdI]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I have never had the opportunity myself to hunt over bait but have been witness to people doing it here in Ohio. I have come to this conclusion. Nothing in the world will ever take the place of scouting. I consistently see more deer than those folks with the baiting locations. I guess if they want to do it that's fine and if you have a dog and poacher problem then that's a different story but I just like to spend my time in the woods the old fashioned way.

[spyderpancake]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I have hunted over corn-piles my whole life. believe me, it is not like you see on tv! I have never shot a mature buck while he was at a cornpile, and i have only ever seen 1 eat from one during the day, and that was in the post-rut. We have so many food sources in our fields and woods that deer do not flock to the corn. Mostly all you see on them is young does and immature bucks. I think the older deer figure out that where there is a corn-pile, there is a hunter. They always seem very suspicious and nervous at them, especially if a deer has been shot there. Basically i use corn to attract does, which will draw in the bucks. I don't think it makes shooting a bruiser buck any less challenging.

[too_pointer]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

[ QUOTE ]

here we go again..

havent we been down this road enough already ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Man, I agree To each his own.

too_

[TreeStandBowHunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

[ QUOTE ]

I was a little suprised that the percentage of people who didn't think baiting deer should be legal. If you don't think it should be, could you explain why?

[/ QUOTE ]

This was the question. If people need to defend the way they hunt deer then maybe they have a guilty concience about it.

I don't consider hunting around food plots or farm crops baiting and I thought I said that. To me...and everybody has there own explanation about it....to me baiting is throwing bait under a stand and luring them in with food. I don't think it should be allowed. If your scouting and doing your homework, you shouldn't need to lure them in with food. Practice your game calls and use them. HOWEVER COMMA,,,If it is legal in your area, go for it. I know the states that I have hunted, it is illegal to bait.

This doesn't need to turn into an argument. The people that turn it into an argument are the ones that need to defend how they hunt. I answered a question and I was done until people started to quote my words to defend how they hunt.

If I ever get to hunt in a state that your allowed to bait, hey who knows, people change...maybe I would hunt over bait

This doesn't have to get out of hand folks, just answer the question, explain why and move on. We all can't agree now can we.

[dogdoc]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

It seems to me that when we get into this debate the majority of the hunters against baiting are from states where it is illegal and the hunters who are for baiting are from states where it is legal.

You guys know that I have a lot of my land dedicated to food plots. I also run corn feeders year round--I don't broadcast much corn as I would rather have the deer filling their bellies with the 20% protein clover rather than 9% protein corn. I will put 200# of corn in my feeders and that will last for 2 months---just a little desert for them and the turkeys. But to be honest---hunting over the food plots is 10X's more productive then hunting over a corn feeder, so in a way--hunting on a 24 hr food source like a food plot is hunting over bait. Around here a well fertilized patch of clover will out attract a pile of corn.

todd

[VermontHunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I have for years used apples and carrots to bring deer and other game onto my property that I hunt, where there was very little to no food sources for them to come to.....with the neighboring property being agricultrual fields (Corn) and Alfalfa Fields,,and the farmers leaving standing corn on purpose for the intent on luring deer to a specific location on the field to harvest them, I have no problem with scattering apples or carrots to try and intice deer and game onto my property.

I see this in the same sense as planting food plots to keep deer and other game from roaming to other properties where the food source may be just a little bit greener. If a farmer is allowed to leave standing corn for the purpose of luring deer how is this different from scattering apples of carrots to lure deer ???

Compitition for superior food sources for game is an age old debate....I say all to his own if it's done legally..

[VermontHunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

The deer actually prefer carrots over apples,,,,and what I really like about the carrots they have no scent (That's noticable to me anyways) and the deer actually have to look for them, which makes them roam around the property, where as apples have a scent and deer go right to them...

I don't know about everyone else's practice of feeding, but what I put out isn't in "PILES" I spred it out in a wide area.....NO PILES HERE...

[TreeStandBowHunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

Hey Dogdoc, I do have that new food plot planted so you never know

That's probably what it is, those who hunt in a state where it is illegal usually oppose it unlike the people who hunt where it is legal. It's probably what your so used to doing ya know

[Rhino]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

I wasn't going to respond to this topic after all of the fun we had talking about it last year. After reading TSBH response I decided to throw my $.02 in.

I don't consider hunting around food plots or farm crops baiting either. Our food plots are there for the deer 24 hours a day and 12 months out of the year. They provide quality nutrition for the deer, turkeys and other wildlife throughout the year. Baiting is not legal here and I'm not in favor of legalizing it. To me baiting is just throwing out some feed (usually corn) by hand or a feeder around your stand to lure in game during the hunting season. It doesn't provide much in the way of nutrition for the deer at all. I honestly believe that hunters would be better served to hone their woodsmanship skills rather than try to lure in deer with bait. Doing my homework to figure out where the deer prefer to travel and what they are going after during the different times of the season and different phases of the rut pays off great for me. I don't need to waste my valuable time in the field putting out bait. I believe hunters should spend their time in the field honing those woodsmanship skills rather than spending time trying to keep their stand sites baited.

If it's legal in your state and you want to bait I really don't care. That's your choice. I just don't feel like baiting is necessary if you do your homework and refine your game plane through your observations and scouting before and during the season. BTW, I don't spend much time hunting food plots either. The odds of killing mature bucks is much better hunting cover than sitting on a food plot where I hunt.

[horst]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

[ QUOTE ]

Now I know there are some who will try to muddy this discussion by comparing baiting to food plots. Forget it! there is no way that you can compare training deer to come to some pre-designated exact spot vs. drawing them to the entire perimeter of a field. Don't even go there. It's not that I am some big fan of food plots for hunting, but that doesn't even belong in the same discussion as baiting

[/ QUOTE ]

Im from Iowa, baitings illegal here, but the DNR leaves foodplots in all the state ground every year around here for the wildlife.To me, they arent all that much different.You talk about a " designated exact spot" as opposed to the whole perimeter of a field.Thats not even close to right.You give a deer herd an entire field perimeter to come into, and theyre still gonna have just one or two favorite entry points.I hunt foodplots on state ground every year and know this for a fact, deer are creatures of habit.So you can have an acre of corn planted and still narrow it down to one or two locations where the deer are going to enter the field.The only thing that will change this behavior is if you burn the spt out by overhunting it.

Im not opposed to baiting, in some areas it may even be neccassary.Some places have swamps or brush thats so thick you couldnt hunt it if you wanted to, baiting deer in these situations is just gonna bring em out into the open where you can possibly get a shot at them.If Iowa were to consider allowing baiting I wouldnt support it though, for the simple reason we dont need to do it to see deer, we dont have vast pieces of unhuntable ground like some of the other states do and theres no reason we would need feeders to bring the deer out in the open.

[Ravin R10 man]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

dont knock it unles you tried it. If baiting is legal, you almost have to also, or your deer are at the next 40 where they are baiting. I see no difference between baiting or a food plot vs farm crops, man is in there some place. having bait out does not mean that every deer will stop at your bait, many times deer will walk right by, if acorns are dropping thats where i am, or a crop field is in season, you better be cued in to that...

[longislandhunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

Baiting is not legal in New York and thats fine with me because I wouldn't do it even if it was legal. At the same time though I won't condemn other hunters for doing it if it's legal in their states. For me I just feel it to be more challenging and sporting to hunt whitetails without using bait piles, having instead to rely on my abilities to locate their "natural" feeding patterns and locations. I have hunted near agricultural crops in the past, and will continue to do so in the future, but I I don't consider that "baiting" because the crops weren't planted for the expressed purpose of attracting deer. But like I said above, if it's legal in your area and you choose to use the technique I don't have a problem with it, it's simply a matter of personal choice.

[VtBowhunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

They just outlawed baiting in Vermont and I'm glad they did, but foodplots are still ok, so that should speak volumes about the difference between baiting and foodplots.

I, myself, have a few plots out but I don't hunt directly over them. I'm always back in from the plots hunting the staging areas.

[VermontHunter]

Re: Why not feed the deer?

[ QUOTE ]

They just outlawed baiting in Vermont and I'm glad they did, but foodplots are still ok, so that should speak volumes about the difference between baiting and foodplots.

I, myself, have a few plots out but I don't hunt directly over them. I'm always back in from the plots hunting the staging areas.

[/ QUOTE ]

Josh, I usually agree with you, but in this case I would have to disagee...here's why..

You said that Baiting and Food Plots differ becuase they didn't ban the use of plots....(if I understood it correctly)

You don't really think that the Fish and Game Dept. wants to have an internal war with the Dept. of Agriculture do you ??? This is the main reason as to why most states allow food plots planted by man...if they were to also ban food plots they would have to stop farmers from leaving standing crop rows such as corn, peas, soybean, sunflowers and such,,to me these are all methods of baiting but is still allowed....

I see no difference in food plots versus spredding out vegtables or fruit in a wide area, to intice game to a specific location on a piece of property...IMO it's all politics just like our Deer Law Previsions that they are trying to get away with....

Once game finds a viable food source that's usually where they will stick around,,,take these plots away and see where the deer herd and other game roam to,,,,the big Ag. fields where the farmer has purposely left standing rows in stratigic areas....I'm not in anyway defending Baiting, but it's a fact if the grass is greener on the other side of the fence that's where you will find the game....

I have dispearsed a large amount of apples and carrots over my hunting years and have yet harvested a deer or any other game over baiting areas but have taken plenty of deer off the wife's uncles farm where he has left corn rows for me and the large clover and alfalfa fields that weren't covered in deep snow....