Scientology question

[Guest Andrea]

With all this hubbub about Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes on the news, I am wondering if anyone here knows anything about Scientology???

I know a little bit. They are into their bodies, breathing and doing something called "auditing" where they "confess" everything to an auditor.

But...do they have churches??? Do they believe in Jesus Christ?? Do they claim to be Christian??

WHAT"S THEIR DEAL??????????????????????????

[buckee]

Re: Scientology question

Scientology is a CULT.

I know...I'm going to hear it now from CH and most likely others too

Yes, they do have churches. We have one here in our town.

There is all kinds of information about it on the web.

Here's a link that might interest you.

http://www.ami.com.au/~bradw/cos/

[Guest Andrea]

Re: Scientology question

I've looked on the web. But can't find SPECIFICS. I know they're a cult. I just wondered if anyone here knew someone who belonged to that "church" or WAS a member and could answer some questions.

Thanks buckee. I'll take a look at that.

[Guest Andrea]

Re: Scientology question

Holy Cow. What a bunch of idiots. I cannot believe that Katie Holmes is willing to leave her religion ( she's catholic) for this wacky world. I figured Tom Cruise and John Travolta to be smarter than this.

What's up with Hollywood????? How come none of them are normal and go to normal churches?

[buckee]

Re: Scientology question

And these people vote too

Now you know where "Some" Liberals get their beliefs from.

OHHHHh...sluggers going to kill me for that one

[Steven]

Re: Scientology question

Ahh yes. Another case of 'I disagree, so it's a cult'. From the outside, every religion can be viewed as a cult. All religions were created by man and are, therefore, flawed. I see all organized religions as cults that prey on the fears of their respective follwers to gain money and power. The bigger the religion, the more powermad.

I don't claim to know much about Scientology, but I do see some similarities with other religions. They go out and try to convert people to their belief system; they hit up their followers for contributions to buy their way into salvation. Sounds like EVERY organized religion to me.

What I do know about Scientology and all it's doctrine is it was created by a Science Fiction writer. The Bible, in turn, was written by people who have claimed to have been spoken to by God and claim to have walked with Jesus. Jesus was killed and rose from the grave to ascend to heaven to reign eternally. Sounds like the plot of a science fiction novel. A Science Fiction novel that could double as a choose your own adventure book. A vast majority of the passages in the Bible can be translated multiple ways, which has been proven by the many different translations of the book itself.

I really just don't see how so many religions exist and all claim to be true and all claim to be of the one true God, but there are so many different Gods worshipped by these multitude of religions. In the Old Testament, God spoke to people with some degree of regularity. With so much question, why would he leave it up to humans to translate his word knowing that the majority of humans are selfish and just want people to believe what they believe? It makes no sense.

People say they feel sorry for me because I'm a non-believer. Don't feel sorry for me- I feel sorry for someone who has been brainwashed to believe.

Don't get me wrong, I tried to believe, you'll never know how hard I tried. But the more I tried, the less I did. Reading Bible verse after Bible verse, seeing how they contradicted each other was a real eye opener for me; After seeking guidance from 'good Christian people' and being treated as a heathen for having the audacity to question their personal translation of the scripture; After going to multiple churches (Baptist, Protestant, C'of Church, C' of God and some independants), and seeing how these different denominations came up with different explanations of the same text, eventually, I just had to say 'this is nonsense', and that is my opinion.

As I sit back and wait for the onslaught of people throwing scriptures at me, don't for a moment think I'm posting and running. This is just a rare midweek, homeday for me. I'll be leaving again later today and returning Friday afternoon to view all the hatred directed my way in the name of the loving Saviour.

[buckee]

Re: Scientology question

I don't hate you Racksie.

[Guest KSNimrod]

Re: Scientology question

Racksie, it can be a challenge to wade through all the garbage people throw at you in the name of Religion. From your post I know you've experienced that! My apologies to you for the 'good Christian people' who have mistreated and misled you. All I know is this: Jesus Christ has never let me down. I can't find one aspect of His character that is a flaw or a weakness. His message is: Come to me all who are weary, tired, hungry, lost, needy, etc. and I will give you life for real. The message of Scientology is a far cry from that.

[slugshooter]

Re: Scientology question

[ QUOTE ]

And these people vote too

Now you know where "Some" Liberals get their beliefs from.

OHHHHh...sluggers going to kill me for that one

[/ QUOTE ]

There's a lot of celebrities into Scientology, if you notice though, most of the ardent "liberal" celebrities are Catholic or claim no religiom at all, Travolta and Cruise are the most "high profile" of the Scientologists, but how often do you hear them speak out as far as politics goes. Travolta lives in my hometown now, I'll try and get a pic of his massive house from a distance, since it is in a private airpark, this place has taxi ways behind your house so you can land and taxi your plane up to the back of your house.

As far as Scientology, I looked into it back when I was in the military and had been hearing a lot about it and was somewhat interested in it. Since I hadn't been going to church in awhile and I guess I was trying to find some answers, meaning to life, that sort of deep stuff. I quickly said no thatnks when I read that basically they believe that we are, are our own Gods and make our own destiny. Even though I wasn't a practicing Christian at the time, I still grew up in the church and knew enough that I didn't want anything to do with it. If someone else wants to be involved in it and their life is more fulfilling and satisfying for them, so be it, I'm in no position to tell someone what type religion they should follow, it's just not for me. I have heard that Cruise and Kidman had some marital problems because he wanted her to switch to Scientology and she was a fervent Catholic. From what I understand, the Church of Scientology has certain tenants like you can't be involved with someone if they aren't Scientologists, things like that, of course, the bible tells us not to be unequally yoked, so really no difference there, IMO.

As far as I know they do have "churches" but it's not like they have services or anything, I think they just go there to hang out or something.

[Ravin R10 man]

Re: Scientology question

I know enough to stay away from it..

[wtnhunt]

Re: Scientology question

[ QUOTE ]

I know enough to stay away from it..

[/ QUOTE ]

Same here.

[johnf]

Re: Scientology question

Scientology is a mixture of all the Eastern religion ie. Hindu, budisim ect. Most Scientologist are very nice, very succesful people with good (compaired with the rest of the world) morals.

Oh yea, they're all going to h e l l.

BTW if you're an athiest you shouldn't care that I said that, because according to you there isn't a h e l l.

[Guest Andrea]

Re: Scientology question

Well, from what I've read ( thanks buckee) apparently L. Ron Hubbard was mentored by Allistair Crowley ( author of the satanic verses) That's all I need to know. Also, we are not aliens, we are not our own God, and it's NOT okay to lie. I feel sorry for those people being misled by these idiots. Good for Nicole Kidman. I'm glad she didn't conform.

Racksie....I see where you are coming from. My question is this:

Even if nothing were true in the Bible...what is the harm in living the way that it teaches? I think I'd rather be safe than sorry. Don't you???

[SaskMan]

Re: Scientology question

Racksie, I cannot believe that someone in this political room shares the exact feeling and beliefs as me. I'm glad you said what you said b/c you said what I've thought for a long time!

[buckee]

Re: Scientology question

[ QUOTE ]

Racksie, I cannot believe that someone in this political room shares the exact feeling and beliefs as me. I'm glad you said what you said b/c you said what I've thought for a long time!

[/ QUOTE ]

There are millions of people who share your thoughts guys. I was one of them once.

I was seeking the truth from man though instead of seeking it from God. (I know that sounds confusing, but it's the best way I can say it). It was indeed The Holy Spirit that drew me closer to God and the truths in God's word.

I took a good look at the world, and wondered, if there is a God, and he created this and us, How and why did it get so screwed up, and where do I go to find out? I was tired of listening to all the different views of mankind too and just started asking God (if indeed there was a God), to reveal himself to me in a way I could understand, because I was so thick headed.

I think the first thing he helped me do was to separate the old Testiment (covenent between man and God) with the New Testiment, and then it hit me one day, I wanted a relationship with my creator and I was separated from him somehow.

Then Jesus' words came to life when I read them "I am the way, the Truth, and the life. No man comes to the Father, accept through me".

That still wasn't enough for me though. I had to know why no man could come to God accept through him. It wasn't until then until I started realizing that it was my sin that separated me from having that relationship, and it was Jesus who took my sin upon himself, so that I could have that relationship with God.

His Grace, given to me through Jesus Christ is sufficient for me. That truth has changed my life, and brought me out of drugs, drunkenness and all kinds of terribible things that had rooted themseves in my life. He saved me, he won't ever leave me and I now have a relationship with him.

That old song is so true "He walks with me, he talks with me, allong life's narrow way" My walk isn't over yet, but I know I'm saved by his loving Grace.

I know this is just jiberish to some of you, it used to be jiberish to me too. My prayer for all of you is that someday, you will seek to know the truth and that God will open your eyes to it too.

[Guest KSNimrod]

Re: Scientology question

Well said Buckee. Thank God for His grace! For those of you who want to check out why Scientology isn't a big hit everywhere go to www.xenu.net or type in "operation clambake" on your search engine.

[Steven]

Re: Scientology question

[ QUOTE ]

Racksie....I see where you are coming from. My question is this:

Even if nothing were true in the Bible...what is the harm in living the way that it teaches? I think I'd rather be safe than sorry. Don't you???

[/ QUOTE ]

I never said that just because I'm atheist that I live a life of debauchery. I'm one of the most moral people you'll ever meet- I'm sure alot of the members of this forum can atest to my character (right, Buckee?). Sure, in the past I had my indiscretions, but alot of people have. I haven't done any drugs in 17 years and I'll be 32 in less than a month... carry the 1... that means I've been clean for more than half my life. I drink an average of 1 margarita and 3 beers (the margarita and 1 beer are on my best friend's birthday and 1 beer on New Year's Eve and 1 during the Super Bowl) a year .I've never seen the back seat of a police car, aside from my late cousin's cruiser before he died (Atlanta P.D.); I've never seen the inside of a court room with exception of a stint on jury duty. I open doors for old people and women; I say yes ma'am and no sir. I treat people with respect. I've never lurked in the shadows stalking a human victim (deer, well that's another story ). I've never tortured my neighbor's cat. I'ver never performed any rituals in a graveyard on Halloween. I don't look for people of faith and try to sway their opinions to reflect my own- everybody's beliefs are their own and should be respected.

So, in short, to see me walking down the street, one wouldn't look at me and say 'He's ATHEIST!' Most seem to think I'm a pretty good guy, because I AM! I look like a regular person just with longer hair. So, in a way, I DO live by the Bible's teaching except I believe that after death you go into a hole in the ground or into an urn, not to some great after life. I believe the end is the end. With the examples of Christianity I have in my life, I find the most outspoken are the most hypoicritical. Take my parents- They both constantly tell me I need to go to church, but neither of them has been in 20 years. A few friends who claim themselves Christian- All are alcoholics, most are drug addicts and most are adulters. I am none of those. I tend to be more educated on the Bible and Christianity than all of them. So, does claiming to be a Christian automatically make one a good person? I say no. Just as I don't think being a non-Christian makes me a bad person.

And to answer your question 'where is the harm?'. Pretending to believe when I don't would make me a hypocrite and a liar- sounds like bearing false witness to me. If I'm wrong, I'll take my judgement, but I also believe the 'better safe than sorry' Christians will be judged just as much as me.

Andrea, I hope I answered your question courteousley and clear enough so people can understand my views.

[slugshooter]

Re: Scientology question

[ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

Racksie....I see where you are coming from. My question is this:

Even if nothing were true in the Bible...what is the harm in living the way that it teaches? I think I'd rather be safe than sorry. Don't you???

[/ QUOTE ]

I never said that just because I'm atheist that I live a life of debauchery. I'm one of the most moral people you'll ever meet- I'm sure alot of the members of this forum can atest to my character (right, Buckee?). Sure, in the past I had my indiscretions, but alot of people have. I haven't done any drugs in 17 years and I'll be 32 in less than a month... carry the 1... that means I've been clean for more than half my life. I drink an average of 1 margarita and 3 beers (the margarita and 1 beer are on my best friend's birthday and 1 beer on New Year's Eve and 1 during the Super Bowl) a year .I've never seen the back seat of a police car, aside from my late cousin's cruiser before he died (Atlanta P.D.); I've never seen the inside of a court room with exception of a stint on jury duty. I open doors for old people and women; I say yes ma'am and no sir. I treat people with respect. I've never lurked in the shadows stalking a human victim (deer, well that's another story ). I've never tortured my neighbor's cat. I'ver never performed any rituals in a graveyard on Halloween. I don't look for people of faith and try to sway their opinions to reflect my own- everybody's beliefs are their own and should be respected.

So, in short, to see me walking down the street, one wouldn't look at me and say 'He's ATHEIST!' Most seem to think I'm a pretty good guy, because I AM! I look like a regular person just with longer hair. So, in a way, I DO live by the Bible's teaching except I believe that after death you go into a hole in the ground or into an urn, not to some great after life. I believe the end is the end. With the examples of Christianity I have in my life, I find the most outspoken are the most hypoicritical. Take my parents- They both constantly tell me I need to go to church, but neither of them has been in 20 years. A few friends who claim themselves Christian- All are alcoholics, most are drug addicts and most are adulters. I am none of those. I tend to be more educated on the Bible and Christianity than all of them. So, does claiming to be a Christian automatically make one a good person? I say no. Just as I don't think being a non-Christian makes me a bad person.

And to answer your question 'where is the harm?'. Pretending to believe when I don't would make me a hypocrite and a liar- sounds like bearing false witness to me. If I'm wrong, I'll take my judgement, but I also believe the 'better safe than sorry' Christians will be judged just as much as me.

Andrea, I hope I answered your question courteousley and clear enough so people can understand my views.

[/ QUOTE ]

Racksie- Proof that Christianity does not own morality.

[Guest Andrea]

Re: Scientology question

Hey Racksie, I respect your opinion. I didn't mean to come off as a grandstander or anything like that.

I find myself questioning MANY things in the Bible but I just try to have faith that what's been written is what God intended me to know. That's all.

And I try not to come off as a hypocrite and that type of person that you talk about. And I do not try to push my beliefs down anyone's throat either.

So with that, I'll end it here.

[buckee]

Re: Scientology question

[ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

Racksie....I see where you are coming from. My question is this:

Even if nothing were true in the Bible...what is the harm in living the way that it teaches? I think I'd rather be safe than sorry. Don't you???

[/ QUOTE ]

I never said that just because I'm atheist that I live a life of debauchery. I'm one of the most moral people you'll ever meet- I'm sure alot of the members of this forum can atest to my character (right, Buckee?). Sure, in the past I had my indiscretions, but alot of people have. I haven't done any drugs in 17 years and I'll be 32 in less than a month... carry the 1... that means I've been clean for more than half my life. I drink an average of 1 margarita and 3 beers (the margarita and 1 beer are on my best friend's birthday and 1 beer on New Year's Eve and 1 during the Super Bowl) a year .I've never seen the back seat of a police car, aside from my late cousin's cruiser before he died (Atlanta P.D.); I've never seen the inside of a court room with exception of a stint on jury duty. I open doors for old people and women; I say yes ma'am and no sir. I treat people with respect. I've never lurked in the shadows stalking a human victim (deer, well that's another story ). I've never tortured my neighbor's cat. I'ver never performed any rituals in a graveyard on Halloween. I don't look for people of faith and try to sway their opinions to reflect my own- everybody's beliefs are their own and should be respected.

So, in short, to see me walking down the street, one wouldn't look at me and say 'He's ATHEIST!' Most seem to think I'm a pretty good guy, because I AM! I look like a regular person just with longer hair. So, in a way, I DO live by the Bible's teaching except I believe that after death you go into a hole in the ground or into an urn, not to some great after life. I believe the end is the end. With the examples of Christianity I have in my life, I find the most outspoken are the most hypoicritical. Take my parents- They both constantly tell me I need to go to church, but neither of them has been in 20 years. A few friends who claim themselves Christian- All are alcoholics, most are drug addicts and most are adulters. I am none of those. I tend to be more educated on the Bible and Christianity than all of them. So, does claiming to be a Christian automatically make one a good person? I say no. Just as I don't think being a non-Christian makes me a bad person.

And to answer your question 'where is the harm?'. Pretending to believe when I don't would make me a hypocrite and a liar- sounds like bearing false witness to me. If I'm wrong, I'll take my judgement, but I also believe the 'better safe than sorry' Christians will be judged just as much as me.

Andrea, I hope I answered your question courteousley and clear enough so people can understand my views.

[/ QUOTE ]

Racksie- Proof that Christianity does not own morality.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice to hear ya'll feel confident enough in your own works to cover you.

I wish I was perfect.

I guess I'll just keep on trusting in Jesus blood to cover me. I already tried the me thing, and I'm not all that reliable

Your right though, when you say Christianity doesn't own morality. But Jesus has the patent on atonement for my sins.

[Guest Andrea]

Re: Scientology question

buckee....."Ya'll" shouldn't include me. I know that works will not get you into Heaven alone. Just believing that Jesus died for me is enough. I think I worded my question wrong to Racksie. I would rather believe in Christ and live how He teaches than NOT. That's where the "safe than sorry" comes into play. To just sit back and believe there's NO Jesus...is not something I am willing to chance.

[wtnhunt]

Re: Scientology question

Morality and Christianity do not always go hand in hand and just because you are an atheist does not mean by any means you might not be a good person. Some people who call themselves Christians in my opinion have a serious lack of morals and values. I have known several people who are in the church every time the doors are open who would screw your wife, partake in excessive alcohol and or drug use, and are really just not what you would think of as a God fearing person or the kind of person I like to associate with. But they can go to church put on their aires and tithe and all is forgiven and they go on with their act.

Then you have the old guy like my neighbor who is a little different who does not believe in God, who would never step foot in a church who would give anyone the shirt off his back and help anyone in need in any way he could. Morals and upbringing do go hand in hand.

Think too many people for a long time now have not raised their children with strong morals and values in the home. Be it due to both parents working and no time for the kids or whatever, the decline of morals in this country has been going on for quite some time and is still heading at quite a steady pace in the wrong direction.