muggs Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 How does everyone feel about this lefty/righty philosophy MLB managers live by. I personal think it's retarded. If I see Eric Wedge pull another pitcher who's throwing good, just because a righted batter is coming up, only to have the reliever give up the lead, I might just quit watching. Any believers in this system out there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? I'm a believer in the numbers game. If a left hander has lefties hitting .150 against him....bring him in! It's a common fact that most hitters have a higher batting average when facing pitchers that throw with the arm away from them. They can see the ball a little bit better and when a ball is coming at 93, it helps. But this also goes both ways. If a certain right handed pitcher has Jim Thome hitting 1 for 30 against him...leave him in. What can I say, I'm an odds man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] I might just quit watching. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah, right. What town to you live in again? You know, I can remember when you looked in a dugout, and a manager was actually managing a game. Now when you look in a dugout, you see a few underling coaches going through their 3" ring binders looking at tendencies and percentages. Yeah, I think they take it too far sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? MCH, like you said it's a numbers game now. I think that's why they do it...to cover they're own butts. With the way managers get canned so easily(even if they make it to the World Series but lose) I think it's a way for them to say, "Hey, what do you want, I played the numbers!" If a guy is batting .300 as opposed to .200 that's only one more hit per ten at bats. Big deal!!!! Let the game who's getting guys out, get guys out. JMHO Chirs, you're right, I'll still watch And like you said, managers should manage, go with their gut and feel out players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? I can see your point. But they don't only do it to cover their butts, they also do it because it works. Ask Greg Maddux, Kenny Rogers, etc. They don't have the best stuff by all means, but they do their homework. They know what to pitch and when to pitch it. They know this because they crunch numbers. They are students of the games. I agree that sometimes they can rely too much on the numbers and not on the individual's talent. Part of me misses the old days when a pitcher lasted the whole game and when relief pitchers would pitch 5 innings at a time....But those days are gone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? Points well taken, but Maddox throws to righties and lefties and studies both. As for the lefty/righty thing working...I would be willing to bet it fails more than it works. Heck even the best hitters in the leage fail 7 out of 10 times anyways, whether they're facing a guy who throws across the plate or from the same side. It failed 2 our of 2 times in the Tribe's series with the BoSox. You brought up another great point, since when did 100 pitches automatically mean you're pulled from the game. I undestand they're trying to protect those million dollar arms. But tell that to Fellar. What makes the old timers so different? Bob Fellar took four years off to fight in WWII came back and threw 36 more complete games. I think most guys could today too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckbuster11 Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? It just depends on the situation. I'm not in favor in replacing any relief pitcher that obviously has his A game on a given day just so you can get a lefty/lefty or righty/righty matchup. How many times have you seen a middle relief pitcher mow through 3 or 4 batters only to be pulled for a more "favorable matchup"....but the next guy cant find the plate if his life depended on it? I dont mind it in situations where the pitcher is struggling and there are guys on base. Depending on whos pitching and whos hitting it might only make sense to bring in another pitcher. But, I think all this righty/lefty garbage is overdone in most cases. Now with all that said, what really burns me is seeing how the lineup is handled according to who the opposing starting pitcher is. The Pirates will sit there best and/or hottest lefty hitters if there is a lefty starter (same thing with right handers)....even if one or two of them actually hit lefties just as well as righties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? John, I'm really trying to not let it effect me, but us being on the same page when it comes to a sports related topic is still freaking me out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckbuster11 Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? Yeah I know. Football season better get here FAST. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] Yeah I know. Football season better get here FAST. [/ QUOTE ] I was thinking the same thing...GO BROWNS!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? Game situation: Two outs, bottom of the eighth, game tied. Joe Blow, a right hander, has pitched very effecitively for 1 2/3 innings allowing only 1 hit. David Ortiz is stepping into the batter's box. Lifetime against Joe, Ortiz is 6-15 with 3 home runs. In your bullpen you've got Johnny Ringo, a left hander, warming up. Against Johnny, Ortiz is 2-12 with no homeruns. What do you do?? I bring in Johnny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckbuster11 Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? I would agree with you MCH in that situation. When a pitcher has faced a particular batter enough times to accumulate stats like you gave in your example I think the right move is to bring in the left hander. But often time relievers have not faced a particular batter enough times (especially players on teams outside of your division) to really have an idea if he is going to be effective against the batter. Now lets take your example and change it to say, neither Joe Blow or Johnny Ringo have faced David Ortiz in their careers. Do you still bring in the left hander? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] Now lets take your example and change it to say, neither Joe Blow or Johnny Ringo have faced David Ortiz in their careers. Do you still bring in the left hander? [/ QUOTE ] In the same scenario(two outs, tied, bottom of the eighth), I would pitch the one with the best numbers againt lefties. If their numbers were similar, then I would probably leave the current guy in there. I'd have to weight the fact that the guy on the mound has already pitched more than 20 pitches under game pressure. But also, the guy in the bullpen is fresh. As far as Ortiz goes, career wise, he hits lefties just as good as righties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] In your bullpen you've got Johnny Ringo, a left hander, [/ QUOTE ] "Well, Johnny Ringo.......you look like somebody just walked ova yo' grave......" Ooops, wrong thread, thought this was the movie quote thread.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? After writing it, I kept thinking.."I'll be your huckleberry.".. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] Game situation: Two outs, bottom of the eighth, game tied. Joe Blow, a right hander, has pitched very effecitively for 1 2/3 innings allowing only 1 hit. David Ortiz is stepping into the batter's box. Lifetime against Joe, Ortiz is 6-15 with 3 home runs. In your bullpen you've got Johnny Ringo, a left hander, warming up. Against Johnny, Ortiz is 2-12 with no homeruns. What do you do?? I bring in Johnny. [/ QUOTE ] Well, I'd manage, If Ortiz was having a great game and swinging good, I'd bring in Johnny, but if my reliever has got his stuff going and getting guys out, I go with him. If it ain't broke don't try to fix it. IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted June 24, 2005 Report Share Posted June 24, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] After writing it, I kept thinking.."I'll be your huckleberry.".. [/ QUOTE ] "I'm afraid the strain was too much fo him to bayer." OK, I'm done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted June 24, 2005 Report Share Posted June 24, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] OK, I'm done. [/ QUOTE ] You may be done but......"I have not yet begun to defile myself."... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted June 25, 2005 Report Share Posted June 25, 2005 Re: Righty/Lefty???? [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] OK, I'm done. [/ QUOTE ] You may be done but......"I have not yet begun to defile myself."... [/ QUOTE ] Well...........................bye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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