snapper Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 I'm not going to jump you about the shot, however I don't feel the texas heart shot or down through the back are very good choices. I wasn't there, I'm not going to critize...but why wouldn't you take that shot if it were a 130 class? Is it because you wouldn't shoot a 130 class? or is it because you know in your head its a bad shot? Me personally, I wouldn't take the shot, but I'd think it would be the oppisite. I'd would feel much worse losing a 180 class over a smaller buck. I'd let 'em walk and try another day. Oh well, its all a learning experience! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" I'm not going to jump you either about your shot selection. You've already done enough of that to yourself. Honestly, though the size of the buck shouldn't matter when it comes to your shot selection so I have to side with snapper's feelings regarding that point. I know you mentioned we would have to be in your shoes. I have been in a similar position before in Iowa on a deer of that class and chose to pass up a very questionable shot hoping for a chance at him again before I went home. The last thing I want is to go through sleepless nights 2nd guessing myself about something I wouldn't normally do so my attitude is I might as well be consistant in my shot selections. At least this buck lives where you hunt. I went home empty handed but the memory of that giant will stay with me forever and the trip was worth it just to see a buck that big. Hope you get another chance at him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tedicast Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] Had this deer been an average 130 class I would have passed this shot. [/ QUOTE ] In my eyes , a doe, spike, 130class buck, or even bigger deserve the same respect as to wether or not to take a shot that may be less than ideal. I myself wouldn't take a shot at a 150 class buck, that I wouldn't take at a yearling doe. A deer is a deer to me, and they each deserve the same respect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCH Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" I'm REALLY not going to criticize your shot selection or jump you, either.........and I won't. One thing you have to watch out for on this site is that you're gonna get people's opinions...good or bad. I swear, sometimes I feel like if you were to post about wiping your butt with 10 sheets of toilet paper, someone would criticize you for destroying the environment!! You live and learn around here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stinger-Hunter Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" I disagree that the size of the buck shouldn't matter. With most hunters whether they admit it on here or not would have taken that shot, I think. Most Hunters, that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" Not a shot I personally would have took. 130 class buck or 180 class buck, if I am unable to get a shot I am comfortable with the deer is walking another day for another possible future chance at a better shot opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] I disagree that the size of the buck shouldn't matter. With most hunters whether they admit it on here or not would have taken that shot, I think. Most Hunters, that is. [/ QUOTE ] One thing Ive noticed and I think stinger hit it right on the head, its easy to criticize someone elses actions but most guys woulda done the same thing weather they will admitt it or not.If i understand you correctly the buck was facing straight away from you, IMO thats not much more unethical than taking a severly quartering away shot which seems to be pretty commonly accepted, the margin for errors about the same, hit a little to far back with a quartering away shot and you hit guts.hit it right and you probably only get one lung, whats the difference?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" All I can say is "DANG THOSE CORNSTALKS", "DANG That ADRENALIN" and "DANG BIG BUCKS" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkoholic Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" Size should have no affect on shot selection. Also, while most do agree quartering away shots are good, there is a point where the angle is too steep for an exceptable bow shot. My opinion, at no time is a shot down at the back of a deer, or any critter for that matter, exceptable and certainly not at thirty yards. As a matter of fact, at that distance the angle of entry (even from 25 feet up) is such that the arrow would hardly angle down into the vitals and the chance of merely deflecting off is quite high. I will say that it sounds like one heck of a buck and hopefully you get a better shot at him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bow Hunter Derek Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" Unlike most, I'm man enough to admit that if a 180" deer gave me that shot and only that shot, I'm 99% sure I'd take the shot. I'd have to agree, if it were a 130" deer, I would have probably not taken the same shot. I'll see a 130 again, but not a 180. Beat me up guys all you want. You are talking to a bowhunter thru and thru. I pride myself in trying to excell as a bowhunter. But I doubt that 99% of us on this board have ever or will ever have a 180" whitetail within bow range. Don't try to pass off this I'd never take a poor shot at such an animal either. None of us know until that point of time. I'm sure I'd take the shot. With any luck it would end up in a recovered deer. But the reality is that I just might be kicking myself (just as canine48 is) for doing it. It's called hunting folks. Nothing is guaranteed. Even that 15 yard quartering away chip shot. At least canine48 made an honest effort for a recovery and is fairly confident that the buck will live for another encounter with a hunter. I applaud him for being man enough to look back and honestly say it was not the best shot selection, and that the thrill of the oportunity took over and led him to try and take such an amazing animal. We all make choices. We all screw up. It's hunting, not an exact science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] Size should have no affect on shot selection. [/ QUOTE ] Sort of. On a small deer the bones are not near as strong and can be reliably broken by archery gear. On older big deer the bones can seem like they are made from iron. So, yes size can matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper Posted October 29, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] I guarantee you some of these people that have said they wouldn't shoot would. [/ QUOTE ] Sorry, thats one guarantee you'd lose from me. I don't need a deer (any deer 180" or bigger) bad enough to purposly take a bad shot and hope to find it. I don't care if it were 400lbs and beat the old world record by 100"...still would not take that shot. I'm man enough to admit I've made bad shots...but not because I took a chance...but because of other errors...equipment prob., twig you didn't see etc... The main reason I won't do the poke and hope shot is, I couldn't live with myself knowing that animal is in pain and could die from other complications. This comes back to ethics...even if no one is around, remember God is watching and will judge us all some day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" First of all, I don't want to sound super ignorant, but exactly what is a "Texas heart shot"? Next, I would like to comment on some of the replies that indicate that the size of the buck determines whether or not you would be reckless in shot selection. I will agree that if a buck was big enough to completely take over your mind and judgement, you probably would take any old shot just because you had temporarily lost control of yourself (one form of buck fever). Many of us have never been in that position, so I guess we really don't know what kind of psychological breakdown we might incur. But I would hope that this idea of reckless shot selection would have to be because of some mental short-circuit rather than a calculated cold disregard for the quick, clean kill that I hope we all strive for. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] Texas heart shot is when you shoot one up the butt. I will say that I did believe my shot would have been lethal. And frankly after talking with some well known hunters I understand that this shot happens successfully quite often. In fact had it not hit a corn stock who knows. Is it a shot we promote. Of course not. How many "perfect" shot opportunities present themselves. A lot depends on the accuracy of the archer. Some archers should never try a shot over 20 yards. I am confident in my shooting out to 40 yards depending on circumstances. There are those who are holier than thou who would tell you unless they are 20 yards standing broadside with a little red target on them and you can range it first is the only shot you can take. Real world, real situations that have worked in the past. Yes it is easy to get on here and become a critic. But the fact is I felt I could kill that deer and still believe I would have had it not been for the corn stock. My crime is I aired my own questions of my shot on here. We all create questions in our mind on a shot we took when we don't see a deer fall in sight. I also know that there are a lot of people who criticize who at one time or another have taken shots they wish they could have back. With this said hopefully we can put this to rest. If nothing else we all have looked at our abilities and recognized weaknesses and will be more tuned in to our own abilities. Thank you all for you "constructive criticism" and especially thank those of you for your understanding and support. However, I'm over it and I'm ready to go after him again. I"M GOING AFTER THAT MONSTER! [/ QUOTE ] Good post canine. Everyone learns from their mistakes and God knows, we all make them. Everyone in here learns something from topics like this too. It looks like you ran the gauntlet in here and still survived I just hope that monster presents you with a better shot opportunity, so we can see pictures of him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowtechTurkeyHunter Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" My reply still stands... poor shot never woulda taken it ... not worth the chance of messing up that deer if it was that bi... trying too hit something smaller then the width of your broadhead... meaning spine is very very poor... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tedicast Posted October 29, 2004 Report Share Posted October 29, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I guarantee you some of these people that have said they wouldn't shoot would. [/ QUOTE ] Sorry, thats one guarantee you'd lose from me. I don't need a deer (any deer 180" or bigger) bad enough to purposly take a bad shot and hope to find it. I don't care if it were 400lbs and beat the old world record by 100"...still would not take that shot. I'm man enough to admit I've made bad shots...but not because I took a chance...but because of other errors...equipment prob., twig you didn't see etc... The main reason I won't do the poke and hope shot is, I couldn't live with myself knowing that animal is in pain and could die from other complications. This comes back to ethics...even if no one is around, remember God is watching and will judge us all some day! [/ QUOTE ] Amen Snapper!...I agree with you word for word! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted October 30, 2004 Report Share Posted October 30, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] Everyone learns from their mistakes and God knows, we all make them. Everyone in here learns something from topics like this too. [/ QUOTE ] The first thing required to learn from one's mistakes is to recognize that it was a mistake in the first place. [ QUOTE ] And frankly after talking with some well known hunters I understand that this shot happens successfully quite often. In fact had it not hit a corn stock who knows..............But the fact is I felt I could kill that deer and still beleive I would have had it not been for the corn stock. [/ QUOTE ] Apparently we do not always learn from our mistakes. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogdoc Posted October 30, 2004 Report Share Posted October 30, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] So, yes size can matter [/ QUOTE ] yikes---don't tell my wife Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted October 30, 2004 Report Share Posted October 30, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" LMBO...don't tell mine either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted October 31, 2004 Report Share Posted October 31, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] I agree that certain shots are all a matter of circumstance. I used to be a stickler for not shooting at deer at distances over 20 yards. However, through lots of practice and gained confidence, I feel that I could kill a deer with my bow out to 40 yards. However, at this distance, many factors come into play. Do I have that perfect quartering away or practically broadside shot? Is the deer aware of my presence? Is there any kind of wind that may effect arrow flight? Is it definitely a clear shot? All these factors come into play. Sure, I am confident in my ability on paper, but can I keep my nerves calm enough when Ol' Freak Nasty shows himself? I don't think that much of this can be decided until that moment of truth, but hopefully it is decided wisely and we don't let the adrenaline and excitement impair our judgement. [/ QUOTE ] Sounds reasonable to me. I'm still at 25 yards maximum, but within reason, that's pretty much a function of each archer's ability. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
py_archer Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] exactly what is a "Texas heart shot"? [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Texas heart shot is when you shoot one up the butt [/ QUOTE ] I did not know that. I did know that hitting one of the main artery's in the hams is a very lethal, more so then people think. I could not imagine trying to settle a pin on the anus though. Would that be the brown pin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted November 1, 2004 Report Share Posted November 1, 2004 Re: MISUNDERSTANDING ON \"ABSOLUTE HOG I STUCK\" [ QUOTE ] If a big ol 180 190 buck walked under your stand and you know the only shot you had was down through the back you would take it. [/ QUOTE ] The shot was not down through the back, it was 90 feet out from a height of 25 feet. That is a shot looking across a deer's back at a 15 degree angle. Also, you have apparently missed the whole point of the discussion. No one is arguing about a missed or screwed up shot or a "shot running off course". The controversy is over the shot selection. Also, I would be a bit careful about the name-calling. For the most part, that kind of crap hasn't gone over too well in this forum. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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