popgun Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Before I get any nasty replies from AR deer hunters, I want to make it clear that here in AR we have different deer limits for different zones, and I hunt in two different zones. Our State bag limit cannot exceed 3 deer unless we have depredation permits etc. Some of our zones require a zone quota doe permit in order to take a doe during modern gun or muzzleloader seasons, and some zones do not. Anyway, I assure you all that all is legal in this true tale which happened today. I’ll not waste any more of your time trying to explain all the zones, regulations etc. I was trying to fill a doe tag. Two nice does and a fawn came out today, and were about to go back into cover at about 125 yards. I did not have a lot of time to wait. My Savage Smokeless Muzzleloader is good for yardage quite a bit beyond this limit, and so is my ability. I picked out the largest doe and boom. It was a perfect hit. Big doe down. I go to check it out and find it is a big button buck. I almost cried, because I want these little bucks to grow, but I also realize that stuff happens. Why it was running with another (?) and a fawn I will never know. Everything is quite legal. I thought it was a doe but it turned out to be a buck so I had to use one of my buck tags on it. We had antlered and non-antlered tags until; I think it was last year. Now our tags are specific for either doe or buck, and if you shoot a button, it has to be tagged as a buck. Naturally, if you do not have a doe tag you could not even shoot at an antler-less deer because you can’t possibly see that well at 100 yards or more. I ended up with about 65 lbs of tender meat. I am almost afraid to try to fill my doe tag now, because if it happens again, I will use up my last buck tag. I’ve been saving that one for the big bruiser that won’t come out during daylight hours. I sure wish the State would go back to antler-less tags instead of being gender specific, but I guess we’re stuck with the way things are and at least it limits our mistakes, and keeps less buttons from becoming tender table fare. Even with binoculars and 10 power scopes, I can’t tell the difference in a button buck and a doe at that distance. From now on my does will be within 50 yards with my scope on high power. Even up close, and lying on the ground, this slick-headed buck had the long nose of a doe, but I was fooled. Has this ever happen to you? ….popgun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Born2Hunt Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? I'm sure this has happened to many of us. CK out the QDMA they will give you many good tips on how you can tell the difference between buttons and does in the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? Yep...happened just this year when I shot my She/He Good eating, but not my choice of deer. I was fooled too, at 20 yrds with the bow, at about 15 minutes before last light. She/He was standing with 4 bucks and a small fawn. Sure looked like a doe to me at the time. Time to brush up on my doe identification Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gitcha_some Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? just look fo the tarsal glands, at that range u cant even see any difference on a doe, a bucks will be black Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? [ QUOTE ] just look fo the tarsal glands, at that range u cant even see any difference on a doe, a bucks will be black [/ QUOTE ] During the rut and estrus periods, a doe's tarsal glands go dark too. That's one of the things we look for in the does, so we know the rut is about to happen. [ QUOTE ] Understanding The Rut Phases EDITOR'S NOTE: Jerry Peterson is the founder and product designer of Woods Wise Products, the makers of quality game calls in Franklin, Tennessee. QUESTION: What are the basic facts a hunter should know about the rut? PETERSON: Most importantly, you must understand the phase of the rut you are hunting. If you don't know, you can make two simple observations of the does, and also look at scrapes to determine the rut phase. Generally, when bucks make scrapes, they are looking for, but not finding does. During the prerut, bucks work scrapes to their maximum. When they stop tending those scrapes, you know you are going into the peak of the rut. The bucks no longer have any reasons to tend scrapes because they are finding what they are looking for. Secondly, you can look at the doe's tarsal glands on the inside of her hind leg and gauge the phase of the rut by the color of the glands. For example, a solid-white tarsal gland means there is no rutting activity whatsoever going on. The prerut phase is marked by a chocolate-brown center in the white tarsal gland. And during the peak of the rut, the doe's tarsal glands are jet black. The fourth point about the tarsal gland is once she has bred, she licks it clean. So you can gauge the progress of the rut by looking at every doe you see. Once you know what phase the deer are in, by gauging scrape activity or studying the does' tarsal glands, you can begin to determine what calls to use. [/ QUOTE ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOMSD5 Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? yep happened last bow season...shot what i thought to be a doe but upon retrieving it it turned out to be a button buck...and he was 10-15 yards of me .....it happens in the hunting world.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HitRmisS Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? that sucks, but no use worrying over it there is nothing you can do about it now... so good luck in getting your other doe and that big buck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smitteken Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? [ QUOTE ] I ended up with about 65 lbs of tender meat [/ QUOTE ] Is this how much it weighed field dressed, or is this how much meat you got off of it boned out? If thats the boned out weight you have a heck of a button buck on your hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popgun Posted December 18, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? That was 65 lb. quartered and ready for de-boning. I haven't weighed the finished meat, but there seems to be at least 15-20 lb. of bone. not counting the lower leg bones and ribs. What little we kept for burger is sure easy to go into the grinder. Most is roast and steaks, because it is so tender. (edit) I just weighed the finished meat on the bathroom scales. 32 lb. total. 25 lb steak and roast and 7 lb. burger. I don't know how accurate bathroom scales are, but I did reset it with the empty box etc. ....popgun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? First of all, totally off subject, but I just wanted to comment on the fact that you had to take 2 paragraphs to qualify, and justify your story. Sad state of affairs in this forum IMHO. We all need to start trusting each other a little more. OK, subject at hand. Totally agree Jeff. Thankfully Ohio still has the antlerless tag. I think a buck has to have 3" or 5" of antler to be considered a "antlered" deer here. And yes, I have done that before. About 5 years ago I had what I thought was a 1.5 year old doe come by me right near quitting time. When I recovered "her" it turned out to be a button. (best venison I've ever had BTW). On the property I hunt now, you will take a fair amount of razzing if you shoot a button, but it happens. I have to study some deer with 10x binoculars even when they're within 20 yards, sometimes it's very difficult to tell. Clues that help me: Buttons are usually alone. Your situation would make it even more difficult to tell, unless maybe your deer are starting to yard up already. That's the only thing I can think of. Another clue that helps me determine a button is their nose and ears. Fawns have that goofy looking stubby nose on them, and their ears look "floppy" in comparison to their heads. Both the nose and ears clues help in holding off on shooting them, and it's easier than trying to find those little nubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tyshe17 Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? this actually happened to me twice last year. Once was in the woods about 60-70 yds. The deer snuck in on me, and it was early. The deer had sun hitting it, and looked huge because of it. I shot it and it turned out to be a nub buck. The second one was only a couple days later in west TN. I was hunting a field looking for a doe to turn into hamburger meat. Close to last light, a big deer come runing across the field at about 80 yds. I almost shot it running but wanted to see if a buck was folowing. Anyways it stopped at 180 and started feeding. I got ready, shot it, and dropped it in its tracks. Here is the pic: as you can tell both antlers were broke off reall low, on a deer that big with no visible horn, I never though about it till I fliped it over to gut it, and found a surprise. I was really upset especially this one, cuz this year he would have been a hoss with that body as a 2.5 year old. Its terrible, and we all try and limit it, but it does happen sometimes, even when you "pick out the big one". My cuz shot one at the end of the season 3 years ago that had already dropped its horns...like I said it happens, but I am sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoyt_hunter Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? never happened to me, in nebraksa if a button buck has antlers 6" or less it can be tagged on a doe permit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETMGROW Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? OH yeah! It's happened. At least you kept the deer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted December 19, 2005 Report Share Posted December 19, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? Nope, have neever mistakenly shot any buttons for does. Have had some out nearly to 100 yards that I thought were does until I looked closer with my binoculars, and did have one in the scope of my muzzleloader at about 85 this year that I saw the nubs on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joebobhunter4 Posted December 19, 2005 Report Share Posted December 19, 2005 Re: Has this ever happened to you? it did 2 times this year... i thought it was a big doe and when i got up there it was a lil nub that hadnt even poped outa the skin yet... its legal here as a antlerless deer if its spike is below his ears tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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