wtnhunt Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] We need to get out of the habit of seeing a white tail and hurling bullets across the woodlot. [/ QUOTE ] Not a habit I am in nor is anyone in my family, but you hear the sounds of the rifle opener here and you know that some do not practice safe firearms practices. Sadly enough you can mandate wearing orange but you will still have idiots in the woods and even some who would shoot someone wearing orange. As the saying goes, can't fix stupid. There is NO EXCUSE for not knowing your target and what is beyond it, that is one of the most important rules that we all ever learn with handing firearms. Those who would shoot a person mistaken for a deer in my opinion have no business in the woods in the first place, hold them accountable for their actions and make examples of them with serious enough penalties to make others realize they can end up in jail by making the mistake of hastily pulling the trigger on an unknown target. People shot in the woods in my opinion in most cases are not accidents but are instead negligence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HaDeRonDa Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] Is there a point to these questions or are you just trying to stir up debate? [/ QUOTE ] Blaze orange and the usage of it is controversial, Isn't it? The title alone may answer your question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] Sadly enough you can mandate wearing orange but you will still have idiots in the woods and even some who would shoot someone wearing orange. As the saying goes, can't fix stupid. [/ QUOTE ] That is absolutely true, and the same thing could be said about drunk driving laws, and probably any law you can think of. However, that doesn't mean those are necessarily bad laws simply because you can't get 100% compliance. [ QUOTE ] There is NO EXCUSE for not knowing your target and what is beyond it, that is one of the most important rules that we all ever learn with handing firearms. [/ QUOTE ] This is the point that I made above and seems to be universally ignored. With today's camo patterns, there is only one place where this rule can be absolutely abided by, and that is on a well maintained and constructed rifle range that has been completely cleared and has an earthen backstop. I have never seen a hunting shot where anyone could swear that there is not a fully camoed hunter somewhere in the background behind the deer whether he be behind some brush, hunkered down at the base of a tree or hiding in some slight dip that you can't even detect. Think about all the shots that you have ever taken and see if you can honestly say that there was no possibility that some guy in camo was not back there. I will agree that there is no excuse for mis-identifying a target (mistaking a human for a deer). Not only should you be able to tell it is a deer, but you should be able to see exactly what specific part of the deer you are shooting at in order to guarantee a proper and humane kill. But that is whole different matter than the "background issue". Unless you search out the background before you shoot (maybe the deer will stay there while you walk back and check this out...lol), there is absolutely no way that you can say that there is no one back there. That's just not the nature of forested land and normal deer habitat with brush and criss-crossed logs and blow-downs as well as the waist high under-growth that obscures vision. How can anyone swear that there is no possibility of a camoed hunter in such stuff. It's not even fully guaranteed with a hunter with blaze orange on, but you have a whole lot better chance if he is wearing blaze orange than if he is doing his absolute best to blend into the background wearing camoflage. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] So Doc, should grandma be forced to wear blaze orange? How about the local NY DEC officer as he patrols? How about the berry picker as RangerClay mentioned? [/ QUOTE ] Look, you do what you can. I would assume that such a law would be an encon regulation which is hard to expand to the general population. However, if you make it a regulation applying to all hunters during any firearms deer season, you will have covered nearly 100% of all opportunities for hunting accidents. Just as a B/O law would not guarantee that you would get 100% compliance or that you still wouldn't get some idiots out there shooting the "orange deer", you have at least given the rest of the hunters some level of protection against the idiots that insist on hiding their way into your line of fire. Hey, I have seen them come walking out of the bushes. Yes, full camo complete with face paint hunting in this condition on some heavily pressured state land no less. You've heard of "suicide by cop"? Sometimes I wonder if this isn't some version of "suicide by hunter". Personally, I really don't want to be part of their little game, whatever it is. And yes, I would like to have a law that at least protects me against the majority of these mental deficients. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We need to get out of the habit of seeing a white tail and hurling bullets across the woodlot. [/ QUOTE ] I cant believe people do this, If you cant see at least a head and the front shoulder what exactly is it your shooting at.Most states you need to see the head to see if its a legal deer, and you need to see the vitals to kill an animal. Gotta go with Doc on the camo issue, one day I went out to a new piece of public ground I wanted to hunt, carried my stand and everything about 1/2 mile back into the section.I actually had the stand set up, and had been sitting in it for about 20 minutes when I noticed Id put my stand not 50 yrds away from a guy that was bowhunting on the ground.I never seen him and he thought it was hilarious, I did to after the fact.He didnt even have a new camo pattern on, old military camo, full face paint, and a black stocking cap.The really sad part, he wasnt even hid that well, he was right in the middle of a big open spot sitting in a little depression in the ground Turns out it was a guy I knew, he was a military special forces guy home on leave, I felt a little better about it then, I thought I needed glasses up to that point I also posted about a guy I almost shot a few years ago.A pheasant hunter told me about a buck him and his buddies go into a huge thicket near the slough here.I was muzzleloader hunting at the time and put the sneak on the thicket.I came around the far end of it and there was about a 30 yrd opening in it.On the far side of the opening the buck and a bunch of does were bedded.They stood up and he was a nice buck, I put the sights on him, no scope back then, and he just stood there, but for some reason I didnt shoot.After the deer ran off I walked around the end of that thicket and there was two of the pheasant hunters buddies standing, they had spooked the deer, the reason they didnt run was they never knew I was there, they were watching the pheasant hunters.Id have more then likely killed one of those guys had I shot, everything happened fast and we were all way to close together. Heres the part I never figured out, why didnt I shoot?They both had orange vests on, I still didnt know they were there, I think maybe I did see a flash of orange and it just didnt register right away.I to this day cant recall seeing it though.But im almost certain it somehow kept that from turning into a very ugly situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWiggely Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] Blaze orange and the usage of it is controversial, Isn't it? The title alone may answer your question. [/ QUOTE ] Not really, if the law state you have to wear it, you better wear it. If there is no state law requiring it to be worn and you don't choose to wear it, well frankly your taking your life into your own hands. Im sure you don't trust everyone out in the woods, and Im also sure if you hunt private property you can not guarantee at all times that there isn't someone on that property either with permission or without. I sure wouldn't trust others not to shoot first and ask questions later. You can come up with a million scenarios to this, and as you know, you will never come up with enough answers to make everyone happy. Do what you like, orange or no orange, lets just hope the knuckle head 200 yards away can see you behind the deer he is getting ready to shoot, and then holds his shot. What to do with the folks hiking or walking the dog, or like they do around here, the mountain bikers, I have no idea. I would like to see the state property closed to biking and hiking during the regular deer season. I don't really know, there is no real good answer for this debate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianxt Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. I was hunting some public land one yr .Heard something comeing I could make out a brown object comeing my way started looking at it threw scope .It was a guy deer hunting no orange on and was wearing those brwn carheart coveralls.Why would any one be stupid enough to do this .I mean come on its rifle seasone and your hunting a animal thats brwn I would think brwn is the one color I would stay away from during this time of yr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] I was hunting some public land one yr .Heard something comeing I could make out a brown object comeing my way started looking at it threw scope .It was a guy deer hunting no orange on and was wearing those brwn carheart coveralls.Why would any one be stupid enough to do this .I mean come on its rifle seasone and your hunting a animal thats brwn I would think brwn is the one color I would stay away from during this time of yr. [/ QUOTE ] I guess its just as stupid as someone using the scope on their rifle as bino's! What if something went wrong with the gun and or you and the gun went off? You have it pointing at a person...wearing brown or not...I'm always sure of my target before shouldering my gun! [ QUOTE ] Snap what about this example....... there is a guy hunting across a ridge from you during rifle season. Say 200-300 yards. In camo, you'd have no clue he was even there. You see a deer somewhere in between the two of you, pull the trigger, and you hit the guy. Now, maybe if that guy was wearing orange you would of at least caught a glimpse of him. You see what I am saying? [/ QUOTE ] Yeah I see what your saying...however...at 200-300 yards...you may still not see someone wearing it and the accident can still happen. There is exceptions to the rules and we can example it to death ie...bullet can travel miles right? What if the hunter wearing orange from head to toe gets hit by a bullet that came from a gun fired 1/4 mile away because someone missed? Does wearing blaze help cut down on accidents? I'd say yes. Does wearing a seatbelt help save lives? Again I'd prob. say yes. Does wearing a helmet help save lives? Again...yes! Do I feel its my local, state, federal gov. "job" to mandate a law for these things? NOPE! They need to take my tax dollars and fix roads and such....leave the common sense stuff for me to decide on my own! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] What if the hunter wearing orange from head to toe gets hit by a bullet that came from a gun fired 1/4 mile away because someone missed? [/ QUOTE ] Interesting point.I cant see 1/4 mile away in a lot of the stuff I hunt, of course we cant use rifles anyway and I dont believe my ML will go that far. But that takes us back to knowing whats beyond your target.A guy sitting in the trees, or around standing corn, cattails, whatever the case may be and hunting with a rifle isnt ever in all honesty going to know what lays that far beyond their target.Doesnt matter if your wearing orange or not, if youre field of views only 100 or 200 yrds you really have no idea whats beyond that.They cant even honestly know where the bullets going to hit out past that, brush, rocks, theyll change the course of your bullet quite a bit.Realistically in stuff thick enough to keep you from seeing that far your bullets probable gonna hit something and stop short but who really knows where its going to wind up after it leaves your gun. We can wear orange head to toe, we can force others to do the same, but were never going to eliminate accidents completely.Were never going to know where every bullet we fire will wind up, we will never know what everyone else in the woods is doing, someone could walk into your line of fire as soon as youre done checking beyond your target. Ever watch your arrow if you miss your target and just glance off the top of it?It changes the whole course of the flight, it pushes it up and goes a lot farther then you anticipated.A bullet does the same thing. Gotta agree, what I wear hunting should be my choice, they shouldnt waste their time and money regulating things like that.On public ground its thier call, they own it, but we had our law changed this least year where everyone needs to wear so many inches of unbroken orange no matter where your at for everything from squirrels to deer.Cant wear orange with a camo pattern, Im not even sure if the smaller size orange vest my son wears complies with this law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Oneida1 Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. Here in Illinois you are required to wear blaze orange during gun season no matter what. Even if you are going for a walk, 4 wheeling etc. If you are in a rural area that might have hunters around, you are supposed to be wearing a orange hat and vest. That is what my local game warden told me anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETMGROW Posted December 3, 2006 Report Share Posted December 3, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. I think blaze orange is a very good idea. Yes, I do wear it. The argument that its requirement is an infringement on your constitutional rights is absolutely ridiculous! Laws [ which the constititution is about] are made to protect us all. If you make the wrong choice and get hurt do you really think you are the only one who suffers? Sit down and talk to your son or daughter and tell them : "I'm going to go hunting, I want to be macho, I may not come back." We are all subject to laws we don't like. There may be times you would like to kill your boss but there is a law against that. How about seatbelt or helmet laws? Aren't they in place to help protect you? If you were to take your son or daughter into the hunting woods, wouldn't you feel better if they were wearing some orange? Would you protest the use of child restraint seats, or would you rather see the face of your young child splattered across the windshield of your vehicle? I have been in a situation where I helped carry a neighbor out of the woods after his own father shot him. I know for sure blaze orange could have prevented this incident! I had another situation a few years ago where I was set up on a hillside looking into the woods when a deer came into view. I pulled up to look at the deer in my scope just as a hunter who had been sitting in a hollow tree down from me about 75 yards stood up to stretch. The deer was between him and me. I got sick to my stomach at what could have happened. In full camo I never knew the other hunter was there. It bothers me to this day. NO LOL here. We all have a duty to protect ourselves and our fellow sportsmen. A little concession like putting on a small amount of orange could make all the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HaDeRonDa Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] The argument that its requirement is an infringement on your constitutional rights is absolutely ridiculous! Laws [ which the constititution is about] are made to protect us all. [/ QUOTE ] Thanks Lynn, That is why it has been ruled that blaze orange be worn by all in some national parks during the hunting season. That is, to not segregate the hunter from society. Someone touched on the idea but no one ran with it. In fact, it has been a constitutional concern, not in the Supreme Court but in our lower courts. A few areas where blaze orange is recommended for hikers if not mandated. Cumberland Trail http://www.cumberlandtrail.org/smoky.html http://www.greenmountainclub.org/news.php?id=64 Applachian Trail Concervancy http://www.appalachiantrail.org/site/c.jkLXJ8MQKtH/b.795531/k.AE1B/Hunting_and_the_AT.htm Wisconsin DNR http://dnr.wi.gov/org/caer/ce/news/rbnews/2005/101705ser2.htm My final thoughts that are abviously shared by most of you. If you want to be seen wear blaze orange. You can never be called a dumby for wearing it. You can be called one for not wearing it. We all agree that we all need to think before we shoot. Laws are for those that need them. Prove to society that we don't need the law. We wear it on our own. For anyone that feels that once the state says something it must accepted and there is no contoversy. Think abortion or racial segregation There is someone around every corner that wants you to conform. Some pay us, we call those people our employers. LOL Others spray paint fur coats!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianxt Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. So what your saying is its ok for guys to break the law by not wearing there hunter orange.And I guess you have never hunted thick cover and have object move at a distance and think to be a deer and scope it and its not even a deer.I guess I just must be dumb a?** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWiggely Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] So what your saying is its ok for guys to break the law by not wearing there hunter orange. I DIDNT READ THAT ANYWHERE IN HERE. I guess I just must be dumb a?** I DONT RECALL ANYONE SAYING THAT EITHER. [/ QUOTE ] Im thinking you misread, or misunderstood his points. Wigs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] We can wear orange head to toe, we can force others to do the same, but were never going to eliminate accidents completely. [/ QUOTE ] Is that what we are expecting out of a blaze orange law? Does any of us really expect that mandating blaze orange will somehow end all accidents? Is that what's required of a law in order for it to be a good law.......100% effectiveness? I don't think there is any law that can stand up to that standard. That doesn't mean that it still can't be a good law and save lives. If it would just get some of these idiots that wear full camo during any deer season that involves firearms, it would make me feel a whole lot better. If they have some kind of death-wish, let them find some other way to satisfy it other than trying to drag me or other hunters into their scheme. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALAN Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. my first time deer hunting was this year..i was dressed out in orange..orange bibs,vest, cap..my group said they could see me better than some who just had like a cap on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] If you make the wrong choice and get hurt do you really think you are the only one who suffers? Sit down and talk to your son or daughter and tell them : "I'm going to go hunting, I want to be macho, I may not come back." [/ QUOTE ] First...I don't have the "choice" to be wrong. Second...I don't know where anyone said it would be "macho" not to wear it. [ QUOTE ] We are all subject to laws we don't like. There may be times you would like to kill your boss but there is a law against that. How about seatbelt or helmet laws? Aren't they in place to help protect you? If you were to take your son or daughter into the hunting woods, wouldn't you feel better if they were wearing some orange? Would you protest the use of child restraint seats, or would you rather see the face of your young child splattered across the windshield of your vehicle? [/ QUOTE ] I guess you missed my point...killing your boss and wearing blaze orange are two very different issues. Also, could you please show me where I said I wouldn't wear blaze orange? Or I wouldn't wear a helmet, seat belt etc.... My point is/was...I don't think the gov. should be trying to legislate common sense. It seems like a no brainer to wear orange, seat belt, helmet etc...but I don't like the gov. telling me I have to wear them. [ QUOTE ] I had another situation a few years ago where I was set up on a hillside looking into the woods when a deer came into view. I pulled up to look at the deer in my scope just as a hunter who had been sitting in a hollow tree down from me about 75 yards stood up to stretch. The deer was between him and me. I got sick to my stomach at what could have happened. In full camo I never knew the other hunter was there. It bothers me to this day. [/ QUOTE ] If this hunter was wearing orange and sitting inside a hollow tree do you think you would have seen him? [ QUOTE ] We all have a duty to protect ourselves and our fellow sportsmen. A little concession like putting on a small amount of orange could make all the difference. [/ QUOTE ] If we all have the duty to protect ourselves AND fellow sportsmen...then tell me why you would use your gun scope to check out the deer? Why not use bino's before pointing your weapon in any direction that maybe another hunter is there. Look...I have no issues wearing the orange...again, seems like common sense to me. But if we are going to preach safety...then by all means know what your aiming your gun at before even pointing it in that direction. I had my cousin and a buddy come over the hill from me on Sat. I knew they were up there because they told me on the radio. They were next to the big oak is what they told me. This was about 230 yards at the top of the hill. Even with my 10X42 bino's...I couldn't see them right away and they had more then enough orange on. So I'm not saying that a law passed will be 100%...just that its not fool proof and that accidents can and will still happen. I don't like gov. telling me what I can and can't do in my home or on my property that I pay taxes on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. One last thing on this topic. Since I posted it is important to know your target and what is beyond it, I cannot help but wonder what kind of statistics there are if any for those who get shot where they were misidentified versus those who are shot off at a long distance through the woods by a stray bullet that missed its mark. I may be wrong here, but would venture to guess that the majority of "accidental" shooting are by those who do not take the time to identify their targets and see something move and shoot what they see moving thinking it is a deer. I would bet the number of accidental shootings that occur where a stray bullet finds it way through woods to a hunter who may not be wearing orange is a fraction of the number by comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ILclimber Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. Yes to Blaze Orange, even on private property when your hunting a new stand or area, you never know if people sneak in there to hunt where your hunting, so I say yes to blaze orange, maybe yes, take it off in the stand, but for all legal reasons, yes to blaze orange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
need2hunt Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. I've stayed out of this conversation and to be honest haven't gone through and read all of the posts. In IL it's the law to have on blaze orange during our firearm season, I've grown up with this law so it is not a big deal to me, but I understand it can be to others that haven't had a law concerning it. The story that I'm about to tell is something that I have never mentioned on the forums before, nor have I told the story to very many people. I couple years ago on the first evening of the Illinois firearm season I was hunting in Southern IL. The property is 500+ acres and there was 6 of us hunting it. We always got together the night or afternoon before the hunt so everyone knows where everyone is going to be, this time was no different. I was sitting on the ground watching a short valley in an open grass field. With about 30 minutes of shooting light left a doe had stepped out into the valley. I waited to see if anything was following her or if she would come closer. She ended up starting to walk across the valley but gradually away from me. She was broadside at 65 yards and I decided to take the shot.... baaaannnnngggg!!!! She bolted, normally I will watch a deer to see where it goes but something else caught my attention. My backstop for my shot was a pond dam approx 80 yards past where the deer was standing. Approx 25-30 yards to the left of where I shot were 2 people without orange sitting on the side of the dam bank hunting. I didn't see them until after the shot, basically until they stood up and started waiving there arms. It was one of the landowners boys and his friend. They weren't suposed to be there as they had told me they were going to be hunting a different area. They had decided not to wear there orange and even though they knew were I was, I never saw them. At 65 yards my shot went straight threw both shoulders of the deer, traveled another 80 yards hitting the pond dam and then landed approx 40 yards out into the pond. If I knew those boys were there I would have never taken the shot. Even a worse thought is if I had taken the shot when I first saw the doe they would have been directly behind the deer and one of them would have probably been injured or worse dead. To say the boys were a little bit pale when I went over to talk to them was an understatement. Over the years I've basically been the one that has taught them how to hunt and the reaons behind why we do certain things, they learned a big lesson that day on how important some things are. Now I'm not in this thread to tell you people in NY if you should or shouldn't wear orange, nor am I going to debate it. I just wanted to share an unfortunately very true story where a possible accident could have been avoided if (1) they were following the law and wearing their orange and (2) they realized how serious our prehunt discussions are. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowtech_archer07 Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. I'm the same. Born and raised in IL so the orange isn't a big deal to me. What a harrowing story and experience for those boys. Glad everything turned out OK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. First of all I apologise to the Vermonters. It was my understanding that blaze orange was mandated. I am now better educated. Second, here in NY I am almost certain that we will all be wearing blaze orange next hunting season. With Pataki out and Spitzer in, it's not a matter of whether or not we will be wearing blaze but how much we will be wearing. I have to believe that the original bills that Pataki vetoed for years and years are sitting on someones desk, ready to be submitted again. Be prepared NY'ers to see a bill with bowhunters and turkey hunters wearing blaze orange. Mark my words Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HaDeRonDa Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. RangerClay, You most certainly are right about Spitzer! I see him signing it for sure. Need2hunt, thanks for the story. Darn scrarey!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWiggely Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] Be prepared NY'ers to see a bill with bowhunters and turkey hunters wearing blaze orange. Mark my words [/ QUOTE ] I here that. You know, Im not against the wearing of blaze orange for bow or turkey along with my deer hunting. But like HaDeRoDa <-sp ? I don't really care for it being shoved down my neck as mandatory. There seems to be no way this topic will ever be settled in my eyes. HaDe is there anyplace you know of that a person can look for those statistics as to how a person was shot, whether it was from misidentification, or someone beyond the target? That would be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HaDeRonDa Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Re: Ok, I did it!! Blaze orange..the controversy. [ QUOTE ] HaDe is there anyplace you know of that a person can look for those statistics as to how a person was shot, whether it was from misidentification, or someone beyond the target? That would be interesting. [/ QUOTE ] Here is a terrible website with some "stories". I'll check with my brother about authenticated stories from NY and where to find them. No promises though. Committee to Abolish Sport Hunting-----from an anti but it's interesting to read what our enemies have to say Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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