legal or illegal?

[IowaDeerHunter]

I was wondering if it is legal or illegal to convert a TC encore rifle frame, to a pistol? I am thinking illegal, but was not 100% sure. I emailed the IowaDNR and they forwarded my message to law enforcement, and I have received no return. So I do ont know for sure.

[Guest Clay008]

Re: legal or illegal?

I think it would depend on the laws in your area. Why would it be illegal?

[IowaDeerHunter]

Re: legal or illegal?

Somebody else said that the barrel would have to be at least 16 inches long.

[johnf]

Re: legal or illegal?

I asked a similar question awhile back.

It is legal, but the paperwork, legal fees, permits and hassle makes it alot easier to buy an encore pistol instead.

[toddpipkin]

Re: legal or illegal?

No paperwork or fees involved.

If the barrel installed on the frame in question is 16" or less, you may NOT have a shoulder stock installed; you may only use a pistol grip.

If you have a buttstock, designed for firing from the shoulder, installed on the frame in question, the barrel MUST BE OVER 16 INCHES !!!!

[ QUOTE ]

from Tim Pancurak, at Thompson Center Arms Co.:

Notice Concerning Encore/Contender Pistols and Carbines

Thompson/Center Arms Co. went all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court to establish the lawfulness of the Contender pistol and Carbine (including the carbine kit), and won. The Supreme Court opinion also establishes the legality of the Encore system, which has similar interchangeable parts.

With these systems, a receiver may be assembled either with a pistol grip and pistol barrel, or with a shoulder stock and rifle barrrel (minimum length 16 inches). A barrel under 16 inches in length must never be assembled onto the reciever when the shoulder stock is attached. Within that parameter, the consumer may use the parts to make a pistol or carbine, and may change the configuration at will.

In 1988, Thompson/Center filed suit against the United States alleging that the pistol and carbine kit used above do not constitute a rifle with a barrel less than 16 inches in length, a weapon made from a rifle with an overall length less than 26 inches, or a restricted "firearm" as otherwise defined in the National Firearms Act. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit and the U.S. Supreme Court agreed with Thompson/Center. Their opinions are cited as United States v. Thompson/Center Arms Co., 504 U.S. 505 (1992), affirming 924 F.2d 1041 (Fed. Cir. 1991).

In the trial court and in the Federal Circuit, the United States argued both that (1) the mere unassembled parts constituted a rifle with a barrel under 16 inches in length, and that (2) use of the receiver to assemble a pistol after a rifle had been assembled constituted making a weapon from a rifle with an overall length less than 26 inches. The Federal Circuit rejected both arguments. See 924 F.2d at 1043, citing 26 U.S.C. 5845 (a) (3) and (4). The United States abandoned the latter argument in the Supreme Court, which held generally for Thompson/Center. Accordingly, both issues (1) and (2) were decided in favor of Thompson/Center and are not now open to question.

Thus, the sale, possession, and use of the Contender or Encore pistol and carbine as described are fully in accord with federal law. The use of these products in all of the States is likewise lawful, except that certain restrictions may apply in California.

[/ QUOTE ]

[AJ]

Re: legal or illegal?

If the frame was registered as a handgun when it was originally purchased,or was sold as an action only, it can become a handgun, muzzleloader, rifle, or shotgun. If it was registered or configured as a rifle, shotgun, or muzzleloader, it can not legally be configured as a handgun.Without applying for a permit from the BATF. The minimumn overall length of a rifle is 26". Read this from the ATF dated 2003.

[hangunnr]

Re: legal or illegal?

AJ is spot on....

hangunnr

[IowaDeerHunter]

Re: legal or illegal?

Well looks like I will just be better off getting the whole setup. Guess that will have to wait awhile, can't really afford another $600 setup.

[bowana]

Re: legal or illegal?

AJ was absolutley right!!!!! Being an FFL dealer we have been all watching the responses to this question....I bet the ATF has as well. Its a big no, no. Kind of like sawing the barrel off an old savage double barrel 12 gauge to 12". Sounds great if you want to be housed by the state for a couple of years...fitting a pistol barrel to a rifle receiver could hold the same punishment as possesing a sawed off shotgun. Stupid, but true!

[toddpipkin]

Re: legal or illegal?

OK, I will obviously go by what ATF says.

But why would Thompson Center send out a letter that seems to say otherwise?? (I added the emphasis in my first post.)

[hangunnr]

Re: legal or illegal?

I would be willing to bet the current version of the law was adopted during the Klintoon era (1994) firearm act. The first document was referring to 1991 and 1992 rulings and the last document is dated 2003. There was alot of activity in defining firearms during that time period.

hangunnr

[IowaDeerHunter]

Re: legal or illegal?

Aren't the receivers or whatever you want to call them the same in the rifle and pistol though? Kinda sucks that you can't buy some sort of liscense having it registered as a rifle and pistol, or something like that.

[AJ]

Re: legal or illegal?

[ QUOTE ]

But why would Thompson Center send out a letter that seems to say otherwise?? (I added the emphasis in my first post.)

[/ QUOTE ]

No where in their letter does it say you can change a gun that started as a carbine into a handgun. It says you can switch from a handgun to a rifle and back. They gave you the truth, just not the entire truth.

Its like making a custom XP100 using a Model 7 action. It can be done very easily, but without going through the necessary paperwork and jumping through the hoops, its a felony. This law was part of the GCA of 1968. Its not new.