Bowhunters you need to read this

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

These folks promble agree 100% Maybe they can use TTH comic for there magaine

Here the facts they give on hunting. We dont need to give them any more US HUmane Society. I dont see the humor and I take it serious.

A Closer Look at Wildlife

Issues Facing Wildlife

Should Wild Animals Be Kept as Pets?

Circuses

Fur and Trapping

Habitat Loss and Fragmentation

Humanely Reducing Agricultural Damage by Wildlife

Hunting

Immunocontraception

Lethal Predator Control Courtesy of Wildlife Services

Longline Fishing Threatens Sea Birds and Other Marine Life

Protecting Threatened and Endangered Species

Rattlesnake Roundups

Shark Tournaments

The Problems and Solutions for New Jersey's Black Bear Population

Turtle Excluder Device (TED)

Wildlife Trade

Yellowstone Bison Hazing and Slaughter

Fur and Trapping

Stop Canned Hunts

Cape Wildlife Center

Urban Wildlife-Our Wild Neighbors

Wildlife and Habitat Protection Programs

Wildlife News

Videos

Receive action alerts, tips,

news and special offers

via e-mail.

HSUS >> Wildlife >> Issues Facing Wildlife >> Hunting

Learn the Facts about Hunting

Corbis

Fall is the time when forest greens begin to blaze orange, as hunting seasons open around the country. Each year, hunters kill more than 100 million animals, and while individual reasons for hunting vary, the industry that promotes and sustains hunting has just one motive: profit. According to the International Association of Fish and Wildlife Agencies, America's 14 million hunters spend $22.1 billion each year for guns, ammunition, clothing, travel, and other related expenses.

To justify hunting to a society ever more concerned about wildlife—including its conservation and humane treatment—the industry intensively promotes a set of tired myths. Learn the facts behind these myths.

Isn't hunting a worthy tradition because it teaches people about nature?

There are many ways to learn about nature and the "great outdoors." At its best, hunting teaches people that it is acceptable to kill wildlife while learning about some aspects of nature. However, the very essence of sport hunting is the implicit message that it's acceptable recreation to kill and to tolerate the maiming of wildlife. Even those who claim that wounding and maiming is not the intent of hunting cannot deny that it happens.

It is folly to suggest that we can teach love, respect, and appreciation for nature and the environment through such needless destruction of wildlife. One can learn about nature by venturing into the woods with binoculars, a camera, a walking stick, or simply with our eyes and ears open to the world around us.

Does hunting help create a bond between father and son?

We do not know, but there are countless recreational and other activities that can strengthen the parent/child bond. Generally speaking, bonding has less to do with the activity and more to do with whether the parent and child spend significant, concentrated, and loving time together. Yet the particular recreational activity is also important, because it can send a moral message to the child about what constitutes acceptable recreation.

Hunting as a form of family entertainment is destructive not only to the animals involved, but also to the morals and ethics of children who are shown or taught that needless killing is acceptable recreation. The HSUS rejects the notion that a relationship of love and companionship should be based on the needless killing of innocent creatures. Killing for fun teaches callousness, disrespect for life, and the notion that "might makes right."

Isn't hunting a popular and growing form of recreation?

No. The number of hunters has been steadily declining for decades. According to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, there were 15 million licensed hunters in the U.S. in 2000, compared with 15.6 million in 1993, 15.8 million in 1990, and 16.3 million in 1980. This drop has occurred even while the general population has been growing. Currently only 5.4% of Americans hold hunting licenses. Hunters claim their numbers are growing to give the impression that recreational killing is acceptable. The facts are that more and more hunters are giving up hunting because it is no longer a socially acceptable activity.

What are state wildlife agencies doing to maintain interest in hunting?

Most states actively recruit children into hunting, through special youth hunts. Sometimes these youth hunts are held on National Wildlife Refuges. Some states have carried this concept even further, and hold special hunter education classes to recruit parents and their children. In addition to encouraging children to buy licenses and kill animals, the states are reaching out to women as well. If enough women and children can be converted into hunters, the state agencies can continue business as usual.

Isn't hunting a well-regulated activity?

No. While there are many rules which regulate hunting activities, enforcing the regulations is difficult, and many hunters do not abide by the rules. It has been estimated that twice as many deer are killed illegally as are killed legally. Hunters will sometimes kill a second deer because it has bigger antlers or "rack" than the first. In addition, duck hunters often exceed their bag limits or kill protected species because most hunters cannot identify the species of ducks that they shoot—especially not at a half hour before sunrise, when shooting begins. Secret observations revealed by ex-duck hunters demonstrate that illegal practices and killing permeate this activity at all levels.

Aren't animals protected through "bag limits" imposed by each state?

Those species favored by hunters are given certain protection from over-killing—killing so many as to severely limit the population—through what are known as "bag limits." However, hunting of some species is completely unregulated, and in fact, wanton killing is encouraged. Animals such as skunks, coyotes, porcupines, crows and prairie dogs are considered "varmints," and unlimited hunting of these species is permitted year-round in many states. At the base of this is the notion that these animals are simply "vermin" and do not deserve to live. Hunters frequently write and speak of the pleasure in "misting" prairie dogs—by which they mean shooting the animals with hollow-point bullets that cause them to literally explode in a mist of blood.

Moreover, hunters' influence on state and federal wildlife agencies is so strong that even bag limits on "game" species are influenced as much by politics as by biology. Many states, with the sanction of the federal government, allow hunters to kill large numbers (20–40 per day) of coots and waterfowl such as sea ducks and mergansers, for example, despite the fact that little is known about their populations and their ability to withstand hunting pressure, and the fact that these ducks are certainly not killed for food. This killing is encouraged to maintain hunter interest, thereby sustaining license sales, because the decline in other duck species has resulted in some limitations on numbers that can be killed.

Isn't it more humane to kill wildlife by hunting than to allow animals to starve?

This question is based on a false premise. Hunters kill opossums, squirrels, ravens, and numerous other plentiful species without any notion of shooting them so that they do not starve or freeze to death. Many species are killed year round in unlimited numbers. In addition, many animals that are not hunted die of natural starvation, but hunters do not suggest killing them. While it is true that any animal killed by a hunter cannot die of starvation, hunters do not kill animals based on which ones are weak and likely to succumb to starvation. Hunters who claim they prevent animals from suffering starvation are simply trying to divert attention from an analysis of the propriety of killing wildlife for fun.

Aren't most hunts to limit overpopulation and not truly for recreation?

No. Most hunted species are not considered to be overpopulated even by the wildlife agencies that set seasons and bag limits. Black ducks, for instance, face continued legal hunting—even on National Wildlife Refuges—despite the fact that their populations are at or near all-time lows. If hunters claim that they hunt to prevent overpopulation, then they should be prepared to forgo hunting except when it really is necessary to manage overpopulated species. This would mean no hunting of doves, ducks, geese, raccoons, bears, cougars, turkeys, quail, chuckar, pheasants, rabbits, squirrels, and many other species.

What's more, hunters are usually the first to protest when wolves, coyotes, and other predators move into an area and begin to take over the job of controlling game populations. The State of Alaska, for example, has instituted wolf-control (trapping and shooting) on the grounds that wolf predation may bring caribou populations down to a level that would limit the sport-hunting of caribou. Finally, hunters kill opossums, foxes, ravens, and numerous other plentiful species without the pretension of shooting them so that they do not starve or freeze to death.

Is hunting to prevent wildlife overpopulation usually effective?

No. Wildlife, to a large degree, will naturally regulate its own populations if permitted, eliminating any need for hunting as a means of population control. Discussions about supposed wildlife overpopulation problems apply primarily to deer. Hunters often claim that hunting is necessary to control deer populations. As practiced, however, hunting often contributes to the growth of deer herds. Heavily hunted states like Pennsylvania and Ohio, for instance, are among those experiencing higher deer densities than perhaps ever before. When an area's deer population is reduced by hunting, the remaining animals respond by having more young, which survive because the competition for food and habitat is reduced. Since one buck can impregnate many does, policies which permit the killing of bucks contribute to high deer populations. If population control were the primary purpose for conducting deer hunts, hunters would only be permitted to kill does. This is not the case, however, because hunters demand that they be allowed to kill bucks for their antlers.

Does hunting ensure stable, healthy wildlife populations?

No. The hunting community's idea of a "healthy" wildlife population is a population managed like domestic livestock, for maximum productivity. In heavily hunted and "managed" populations, young animals feed on artificially enhanced food sources, grow and reproduce rapidly, then fall quickly to the guns and arrows of hunters. Few animals achieve full adulthood. After 20 years of heavy deer hunting at the Great Swamp National Wildlife Refuge in New Jersey, for example, only one percent of the deer population lived longer than four years, and fewer than ten percent lived longer than three years. In a naturally regulated population, deer often live twelve years or longer.

Though hunting clearly kills individual animals, can hunting actually hurt wildlife populations?

Yes. Hunters continue to kill many species of birds and mammals (e.g., cougars, wolves, black ducks, swans) that are at dangerously low population levels. While hunting may not be the prime cause of the decline of these species, it must contribute to their decline and, at a minimum, frustrate efforts to restore them.

Even deer populations may be damaged by hunting pressure. Unlike natural predators and the forces of natural selection, hunters do not target the weaker individuals in populations of deer or other animals.

Rather, deer hunters seek out the bucks that have the largest rack. This desire for "trophy sized" bucks can and has had detrimental effects on the health of deer herds. First, hunting can impact the social structure of a herd because hunters kill the mature males of a herd and create a disproportionate ratio of females to males. It is not uncommon to find a herd that has no bucks over the age of three. Second, genetically inferior bucks may be left to propagate the species, thereby weakening the overall health of the herd.

Because hunters largely want to shoot only bucks, hunting may cause artificial inflation of deer populations. When these populations reach levels that available habitat cannot support, increased disease and starvation may be the result.

We don't understand the full effect of hunting on wildlife behavior or health because wildlife agencies will not conduct the studies necessary to find the answers (e.g., "spy-blind" observations of duck hunting, in which undercover authorities secretly observe hunters).

Is hunting for food a good way to save money on grocery bills?

Almost never. When all costs are considered (i.e., license fees, equipment, food, lodging and transportation), hunting is not an economical way to provide food. Statistics gathered by the University of Maryland's Extension Service revealed that hunters spent more than $51 million to kill 46,317 deer in Maryland in 1990, approximately $1,100 for each deer killed. Assuming that the meat of each deer killed was preserved and eaten, and that each deer provided 45 lbs. of meat, the cost of venison in 1990 in Maryland was $24.44 per pound. For most hunted animals, such as ducks, doves, rabbits, squirrels, and crows, among others, use for food is now minimal, and the expense of equipment far outweighs the value of any food that is obtained. For the vast majority of hunters, hunting is recreation, not a means of gathering food.

[AdvantageTimberLou]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

[ QUOTE ]

Funny thing Im defending Realtree over there. You guyd bash just as much and are just as bad here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not true Daniel and you know that, the moderators here do a great job as do the ones over at AT its just so many more people over there and its hard to catch all the stuff going on. There are some posts that get down right insulting and language gets pretty rough, here they can police it better as its a smaller group of members. Both sites are great and you do an awesome job at promoting both, don't get mad over this thread and leave this forum, especially a thread that you started.

That cartoon is not the demise of bowhunting as we see it, it was just a little joke from the gun hunters from Texas, just like the political cartoons we see in the newspapers everyday, they hit a nerve is someone who find them tasteless. Please don't get mad at Tony over this deal. He is as dedicated to archery as they come.

[bigbuckkilla89]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

I would have to say it was meant to be a joke. Whether you find it funny or not that is what it was meant to be.I myself do not think that this will change anyones opinion on bowhunting. If you truly love bowhunting it would take alot to change your mind right.....Some little cartoon like this is gonna make anyone who likes or loves bowhunting and archery stop liking it.And im sure the people who dislike bowhunting and archery arent gonna hate it anymore after this cartoon. I say everyone who is over reacting just needs to cool off and lighten up And realise that this cartoon was drawn as a joke.

[Guest PSE_Archer]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Pathetic!!!! People like that give bowhunters a bad name. It really irks me when people like that set forth that image for all bowhunters.

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Texas Trophy Hunters is sending apologys to most and they understand from the emails sent that it is disstastefull. Its still something hunters shouldnt be posting regardless. Wounded animals is something Peta loves to read especially from hunters. AT is the forum it is today because they do allow members to voice there opionions more. Thats not a bad thing, its a passionate sport hunting. Lots of different views from hunters and often the worse threads become very informitive, good example is a Pope and Young thread I started. Got people aware what Pope and Young does besides scoring. I have always been honest with Tony and he will respond. I would want the same from him. I did see where he apoligized for his comments to some Texans, he was just responing to a thread about hunters about Iowa. Bashing forums is never good thing regardless what you think. Many I dont like but would never come publicly and say it other than Peta and Humane Society in which I will continue to fight them always and for ever. I have always enjoyed my friend here and at AT and always will. But bashing is never good. Being amod is not fun and your under a microscpe all the time. I dont miss it at all at AT. I like being average Joe.

DB

DB

[AdvantageTimberLou]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Daniel your an asset on both sites. I never wanted your moderator gig over at AT, that was/is a full time deal and you were always there to answer my questions when you were one. Your P&Y thread took some heat but I found it very informative and glad you started it.

I know your passionate about the sport and thanks for bringing this to our attention and have a great New Year! Its guys like you that make me visit both sites.

[Gator]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Joke or not, this shows BOWHUNTERS in a poor, distasteful light, and should not have been done, ESPECIALLY by a "hunting" publication. I am really surprised that some have the attitudes they have concerning this, and aren't appalled by it. I know I am, as we all as hunters should be. We as hunters need to learn to quit arguing amongst ourselves when it comes to hunting related issues and our opinions. All we are doing is shooting ourselves in the foot.

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Lots of great guys here on the forum. Me and Tony are friends and he has stayed here at my home and oneday I hope to visit his state. Wont be the last time we dissagree, if only he would understand Mathews is better than a Hoyt(LOL) People make the forums what they are and many are so passionate about hunting. We all must stick together because USHS is for real and gaining popularity all the time. I see there propaganda in the schools and Hollywood. Took my coach Dean Pridgen out this morning and he smoked a doe on my lease, thats worth fighting for anyday.

DB

DB

[Guest matthews32]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

I agree with Tony.

[shockwave]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

[ QUOTE ]

Here is the cartoon that is causing a stir.

[/ QUOTE ]

you guys gotta watch downloading stuff like this.. Those radicals like to put nasty virusus in stuff like that, it`s called cyber terrorisim

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

For those of you that think TTH doesnt realize they were wrong and so are you about this. There is never a time when this is humorous. Here what they have to say. Im surprised any bowhunter would find this humorous. USHS most likely will take this and use this.

DB

December 28, 2006

In regards to: The "Bowhuntin' Startin' Kit" cartoon printed in the Jan./Feb. 2007 issue of the Journal of the Texas Trophy Hunters Association and the Journal of the Alabama Trophy Hunters Association

Dear members of the Texas Trophy Hunters Association, Alabama Trophy Hunters Association and readers of the Journal of the Texas Trophy Hunters Association and the Journal of the Alabama Trophy Hunters Association,

Please allow us to offer our personal and sincere apology to each one of you.

The cartoon entitled “Bowhuntin' Startin' Kit", published in the Jan./Feb. issue of the Journals, in no way reflects our view of bowhunting or more specifically bowhunters. There is no excuse for an item of poor taste, such as this, slipping through the editorial review process. We have taken immediate steps including an emergency meeting of management and editorial staff which will result in disciplinary actions and a more strict review process. A statement of explanation and apology will be printed in the next several issues of the Journals.

In no way does the management of this organization find the cartoon to be humorous nor do we support this view of bowhunting. We are as angry about this as you are! As a matter of fact, we are avid bowhunters ourselves!

We will continue to strive to support the rights of the hunting community and hunters, be it bow or gun. We just hope you understand that when you have a company with as many employees as we have there always a chance something can go wrong. No question about it- this is wrong! I will personally see to it that this will never happen again. Please forward my response to anyone who is an offended bowhunter.

Please accept our deepest and most sincere apology. We are available to you for comment or questions at any time.

Respectfully yours,

Jerry Johnston, President and Founder

Texas Trophy Hunters Association

Leroy Sisco

Chief Executive Officer

Joe Betar

Chief Operating Officer

Joe Betar

Chief Operating Officer

American Trophy Hunters Association

email: [email protected]

(210) 523-8500

(800) 800-3207

FAX (210) 523-8871

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Peta has already posted about this. No big deal some say here, big deal to them. Maybe it should be a big deal to us hunters. Tony talks about todays times, well if he reads the Humane Society website he may find out about todays times, we are not winning the war. Seems they are taking everthing and making it a big deal.

[Tony]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

i never said anything about todays times..

was the cartoon bad yes.

was it in poor taste.yes

was it the first time a cartoon or t shirt has put bowhunting or deer hunting in a bad light, NO.

where were all of you on this other stuff?

this is the question i ask. if all of you think this cartoon is the 911 of bowhunting world, then why havent you said the same thing about any cartoons or t shirts or videos in the past ?

please show consistancy in your opinions.

as for bashing AT.. all i said was i was going to catch holy heck there.. is that bashing ? nope just stating what i know to be fact.

Tony

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Obvious this was more different from others because it got lots of attention. Some of Foxsworthys stuff is used by Peta/USHS, TTH magazine took very serious.

Wasnt just you but some here took your comment about AT added to it.

Its a war and times are tough. Hunting is declining in many states. Thats never a good thing.

We need to be carefull how talk about each other. Hunting is so diverse.

[Tony]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Dan you are so right buddy.

i wish there was just 1 organazation that all hunters were members of. then maybe we could fight this stuff with a single point to focus on.

have all the other organazations in there, but all under 1 flag so to speak. then we could get some real progress done.

but you and i both know it will never happen. having our hunter numbers fragmented into 30 little groups is what peta and the others love to see.

Shoot Strong

Tony

[Okbwhtr]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Totally agree. Future doesnt look bright. I try to stay optimistic in these times. Hunters need to wake up a realize hunting is not garanteed in the consititution.

DB

[Brianxt]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

Bow hunting is going to be the way of the future the way that farms is being devolped.If we as hunter don't put or selfs out of hunting all together by all the putting down other hunters customes of hunting.

[Widowmaker]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

I emailed them and told them what I thought of their cartoon and about two days later I got an email from the director himself and personally apologized to me for letting this slip through and that they did not mean to belittle bowhunting. He said they were taking action for whoever let this cartoon out.

[hoytman26]

Re: Bowhunters you need to read this

I'm not going to let one idiot bring me down. You want to know the sad thing, its bad enough we have to defend our selves every day from people who dont hunt much less a so called hunter himself. People already look at us as that one toothed hillbilly in that stupid picture. I know 100's of hunters and they are some of the smartest, most educated, money smart people I know. I like to think of myself as the same. Unless you are a true hunter you will never understand the feeling I get when I'm in the woods. Its not even about the harvest it's about spending time with my dad and friends doing something that my ancestors did hundred's of years ago and much more.