Guest wildotter Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 So, I've got my DVR set up to record a bunch of the new hunting shows for the start of this new season. I'm sitting here watching one called "Bowhunting North America" on the Sportsmans Channel, that I've never watched before. The guy hosting the show (not sure on his name), shoots what he claims is his biggest buck ever. It was a nice buck, but I noticed while this buck and others were feeding below his tree that they were eating what looked like corn that had been thrown out in the road (I think they were in Texas). Anyway, after he shot the buck, he climbed down to get his arrow. He found it stuck in the ground right where the buck was standing, right in the middle of the corn. Then he points to a tarsal gland hanging in a bush right beside him and says the following: "I've got some ahh Wildlife Research Tarsal gland scent hangin' here in the tree, and he was eatin' right by it." Now, to me that implies that the tarsal gland was the reason that buck was there and eating right there. I have watched the segment a couple of times and never saw the buck even sniff the tarsal gland hanging right above his head. This just makes me sick. Obviously I'm not a big advocate of hunting over bait piles (even where it is legal), but why try to give credit to a product you're pushing when you were hunting over bait? Now if the guy would have plugged the local Co-Op or Feed Store for providing the best corn available for deer, then at least he would have been consistent. Anyway, guess I can take this show off my DVR. Sorry...just had to vent for a minute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravin R10 man Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Ive noticed many shows hunt over corn..even Real Tree folks! Yes Real Tree..even though they try to conceal it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowtechTurkeyHunter Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 OH boy ... lol this is going to be a good one to watch ... you know where its legal go for it ... who cares ... as far as the sponsorship ... that is real easy ... its what he is paid to do plain and simple ... what again EXACTLY is the problem with hunting over bait? (where legal) I forget.... Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xOZx Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 what again EXACTLY is the problem with hunting over bait? (where legal) I forget.... Steve Hey, if it's legal and a feller needs to bait in order to score...go for it. It's kinda like fishing with dynomite...a hand ain't got the skills to run fishing pole well enough to boat some fish...go buy 'em at the store or use dynomite. Crutch it up...it's legal... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowtechTurkeyHunter Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Hey, if it's legal and a feller needs to bait in order to score...go for it. It's kinda like fishing with dynomite...a hand ain't got the skills to run fishing pole well enough to boat some fish...go buy 'em at the store or use dynomite. Crutch it up...it's legal... Bad comparison ... first of all dynamiting is illegal to fish everywhere ... baiting isn't ... I don't have to bait to score ... we cant bait in Iowa ... whats the big deal ... just because someone baits doesnt mean mean that they are going to score ... you still have to put your time in ... and thats what hunting is all about its not about the kill to me ... Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preacherman Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Bad comparison ... first of all dynamiting is illegal to fish everywhere ... baiting isn't ... I don't have to bait to score ... we cant bait in Iowa ... whats the big deal ... just because someone baits doesnt mean mean that they are going to score ... you still have to put your time in ... and thats what hunting is all about its not about the kill to me ... Steve Well said Steve! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhunter91 Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 I do gotta agree with Oneida Man here.. the RT guys do hunt over bait.. On the most recent Monster Bucks series, Waddell is hunting out of a ground blind over bait, but the bait is concealed behind a log on the ground. Kinda obvious when there are three deer standing there eating behind one particular long. Also.. Now I see Waddell pushing that C'mere Deer crap along with Hank Parker. Seems to me Michael Waddell is a sellout. And to think, I used to like him, but I guess now that he isn't a fair chase guy, like the Drury's, I have to give up on him. I mean.. don't get me wrong.. Where legal, go for it, by all means. But when I see these pro's hunting over bait I just get very disgusted because I think that they should hunt fair chase. But hey.. that's my personal opinion.. I know there's gonna be 9 billion people replying to this who disagree.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tyridgerunner Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 hows it going guys. i am going to say a few things about baiting. i hunt in NC and we are able to bait. like steve said you still have to do some scouting,stand placement, etc. you have to work when you bait to watch your scent, the amount of times you going and bait and when you hunt you have to watch the wind and hunt the wind right. baiting in my book ain't all that bad. one thing i will say, more people ought to try to come to NC and take a nice buck w/out baiting. i just hope you have plenty of time to kill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravin R10 man Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Joe,...EXACTLY the episode (bait behind a log to conceal it)..I had in mind when I posted it!! Thats what I meant by being observant while watching these shows, I dont personally have a problen with baiting if legal...and if you are, show it, and or tell what you are doing..dont mislead the veiwers. I agree with you Joe..but I guess to each his own, as long as it is legal..but dynomite?....I wonder if I can hollow out a corn cob...tied to my casting rod..."trolling for big bucks"..LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 .. On the most recent Monster Bucks series, Waddell is hunting out of a ground blind over bait, but the bait is concealed behind a log on the ground. Kinda obvious when there are three deer standing there eating behind one particular long... And you know this to be a fact, correct? As far as the question at hand, I agree. I hate when hunting shows, any of them, insult the viewer's intelligence. The tarsal gland over bait is a good example. The other one that gets me, and the idiot producers keep doing it, is the fake blood trail and the fake re-enacted shot. Irks me beyond belief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhunter91 Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 And you know this to be a fact, correct? Chris.. it's a bit obvious when there are three deer standing there eating behind one particular log. Waddell never came out and said it but it was very obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
need2hunt Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Joe, since when is hunting over bait in a LEGAL state not fair chase? Do you think that when the Drury's show their Texas prostaffers Al Shacklett and Ty Bartoskewitz shooting deer in Texas that there is no possibility that they are legally using bait? And because they don't take the time out of the hunt to say that there is bait or show the bait that they are purposely concealing it? Or that when the Drury's legally feed their deer at feed stations through the year that they are no longer using fair chase methods? My point isn't Drury vs Realtree as I really enjoy the work that Mark and Terry do too, I just don't see how you are comparing one as fair chase and not the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhunter91 Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Maybe in a state where baiting is legal, it is considered fair chase. But then again, I think that's an oxymoron. With baiting, you virtually have the edge vs sitting in a strategically placed stand. The odds are more so in your favor with bait because you have an idea of where the deer are going to be. Isn't the Drury's motto " 100% wild, 100% fair chase. " ??? Never have I ever seen on any of the Drury's shows the actual Drury brothers baiting camera sites or hunting over bait. Yes.. because they don't take the time to say that they are hunting over bait, they are concealing it. Otherwise, if they wanted the viewers to know, they would mention. Withholding information is lying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wildotter Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Guess I didn't make my point very clear on this one. Even though I'm not a fan of baiting, I don't completely disagree with it. And, I understand these guys have to push their sponsor's products, but this one was just too over-the-top! I'm not saying anyone is wrong for hunting over bait where it is legal! Although I don't (not legal in Arkansas), and don't believe I would if it were, everyone has a right to hunt over bait if legal. I understand a lot of the professional hunters do so over bait at times, although most at least make an effort to conceal it. This is also one of the reasons I don't watch nearly as many shows as I use to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Chris.. it's a bit obvious when there are three deer standing there eating behind one particular log. Waddell never came out and said it but it was very obvious. Obvious, or fact? Which is it? What I'm saying is that you're making a huge supposition. If you believe that, nothing I say will change your mind obviously. Now, if Waddell came out and said, "yeah, we were hunting over bait" then I'd say you have a basis for your feelings about him, but to go on a supposition is a bit short sighted IMHO. Just my .02. Anyway, probably shouldn't hijack the thread anymore, so I'll stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xOZx Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Bad comparison ... first of all dynamiting is illegal to fish everywhere ... baiting isn't ... I don't have to bait to score ... we cant bait in Iowa ... whats the big deal ... just because someone baits doesnt mean mean that they are going to score ... you still have to put your time in ... and thats what hunting is all about its not about the kill to me ... Steve I hear ya. It is legal and that's why I am not outraged. Sure, you still have to do some work. However, I can guarantee myself success if I were allowed to bait. A more fair comparison...roboducks (spinning wing decoys) While they have lost a bit of their luster, I have seen first hand the difference of hunting with and without them. Unfair chase? no, they are legal for now. However, I feel it unfair to use them...but that's just me I reckon. To each his own. None of you or the pros are looking for my respect...so do what makes you feel best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowtechTurkeyHunter Posted July 7, 2007 Report Share Posted July 7, 2007 Isn't the Drury's motto " 100% wild, 100% fair chase. " ??? Never have I ever seen on any of the Drury's shows the actual Drury brothers baiting camera sites or hunting over bait. That you have seen ... plain and simple it happens ... I guarantee if the Drury;s do a hunt in texas ... its baiting ... you know that most if not all of the outfitters in Texas put spreaders on there trucks .. thats so they can corn the paths ... how do you think them deer know to come to the roads to eat ... you dont see it cause its so thin ... I guarantee you its there ... why is baiting not fair chase? just curious ... I mean if you walk up to a deer eating a pile of corn wont that deer run away ... doesnt it have the option to just leave if it sees you ... you still have to be where the deer are is my point. And that take a ton of work ... at least here in Iowa it does ... dont know about anywhere else Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xOZx Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Seriously? It is not that much work to go out once a week and dump a pile of corn. Then, place a stand convenient to the routine pile location well ahead of season. Then, put out trail cams to mark when deer visit the pile. Then, show up well ahead of time that deer visit pile and shoot said deer when they arrive for their daily feed. It's akin to hunting cattle. They come to the same spot to feed, all you gotta do is show up early and not spook them. Fair chase is patterning them as opposed to establishing the pattern for them. Can you honestly admit that you are equally successful without baiting? If you are going to say that then you will have to admit there is MUCH more effort exerted in patterning and locating deer without a bait pile. Just another dose of my $0.02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michiganbowhunter_SQ2 Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Seriously? It is not that much work to go out once a week and dump a pile of corn. Then, place a stand convenient to the routine pile location well ahead of season. Then, put out trail cams to mark when deer visit the pile. Then, show up well ahead of time that deer visit pile and shoot said deer when they arrive for their daily feed. Fair chase is patterning them as opposed to establishing the pattern for them. well then i guess food plots shouldn't be considered fair chase either right? i am not against either, but if one is going to be labeled as "not fair chase" the other has to as well...it may take more work to put in a food plot, and the nutritional value may be better in plots...but the purpose is the same. i can gaurantee there isn't on hunter who goes through the trouble of planting a food plot, without the intent of hunting over or around it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrelhunter91 Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Michigan... not exactly. Although with food plots, it is somewhat easier to pattern them and establish the pattern for them, they don't always enter the plot at the same spot and can pass just out of range ( bow or gun ) and live another day, whereas bait is set up well within range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michiganbowhunter_SQ2 Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Michigan... not exactly. Although with food plots, it is somewhat easier to pattern them and establish the pattern for them, they don't always enter the plot at the same spot and can pass just out of range ( bow or gun ) and live another day, whereas bait is set up well within range. that may be, but the purpose is still the same...plots go in to lure in the deer, same as bait. with that said, i am just going to say, do and say what you guys want, if you don't hunt over bait piles, then thats fine, but don't come down on people who do things different than you and are doing it LEGALLY, just because it isn't something you do, doesn't make it wrong... i usually try to stay out of these pointless discussions, because they turn into people bickering back and forth about "my way is right and yours is wrong" or "my ethics are what everyone should follow, and if you don't then you are not as good as me" all i can say to these people (and i am not talking to anyone in particular) is get over yourself and do your own thing and let others do theirs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Finn Posted July 8, 2007 Report Share Posted July 8, 2007 Seriously? It is not that much work to go out once a week and dump a pile of corn. Then, place a stand convenient to the routine pile location well ahead of season. Then, put out trail cams to mark when deer visit the pile. Then, show up well ahead of time that deer visit pile and shoot said deer when they arrive for their daily feed. It's akin to hunting cattle. They come to the same spot to feed, all you gotta do is show up early and not spook them. Fair chase is patterning them as opposed to establishing the pattern for them. Can you honestly admit that you are equally successful without baiting? If you are going to say that then you will have to admit there is MUCH more effort exerted in patterning and locating deer without a bait pile. Just another dose of my $0.02. OZ, Please tell us how you hunt. What is the area like? Do you hunt near corn crops or other agricultural areas? What type of equipment do you use? Forgive me, I'm just curious how you do things. For me, I hunt deer in the big woods of Northern Wisconsin with bait. There isn't a farmer or agriculture field within miles of my area. Couple crappy hay fields for the neighbor's beef cattle, but no corn, soybeans or other good stuff to hunt around. Oh yeah, welcome to Realtree. You may want to check out Archerytalk.com. Your comments of slamming other people who hunt legally in their area will fit right in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xOZx Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 OZ, Please tell us how you hunt. What is the area like? Do you hunt near corn crops or other agricultural areas? What type of equipment do you use? Forgive me, I'm just curious how you do things. For me, I hunt deer in the big woods of Northern Wisconsin with bait. There isn't a farmer or agriculture field within miles of my area. Couple crappy hay fields for the neighbor's beef cattle, but no corn, soybeans or other good stuff to hunt around. Oh yeah, welcome to Realtree. You may want to check out Archerytalk.com. Your comments of slamming other people who hunt legally in their area will fit right in there. Thanks for the welcome Finn... If you will go back and read my posts, you'll notice I did not "slam" anyone. I question the idea of baiting and that is it. I tried to make some comparisons that were not understood so...no biggie. I hunt in Southern Illinois, and yes, there are crops plnted under normal routine agricultural practices. The thing is, every farm has them. One cornfeild no different than the thousands of others. To liken it to baiting...or even feed plots, would be like me having the only cornfield for acres. How hard would it be for me to figure out where they feed? Look, you hunt the way folks are allowed to hunt. That is definitly your right. Enjoy it and I wish you success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andrea Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 xOZx.........is your real name Tred Barta???? I get the feeling you come from his line of thinking. Which is fine if that's the way you wanna hunt. But don't think you are gonna come in here to this forum and try to sway people with your opinion that baiting is wrong. If it's legal in your state, then you have every right to hunt that way. Trail cams, rifles, crossbows, scopes, gps units, and all. Please don't think that I am being mean, but this is a very tired subject. I almost didn't want to reply. But I'm feeling jumpy tonight. Welcome to RealTree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xOZx Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 xOZx.........is your real name Tred Barta???? I get the feeling you come from his line of thinking. Which is fine if that's the way you wanna hunt. But don't think you are gonna come in here to this forum and try to sway people with your opinion that baiting is wrong. If it's legal in your state, then you have every right to hunt that way. Trail cams, rifles, crossbows, scopes, gps units, and all. Please don't think that I am being mean, but this is a very tired subject. I almost didn't want to reply. But I'm feeling jumpy tonight. Welcome to RealTree. Nope, never heard of Tred Barta. And, I am not going to try and sway anyones thinking. I just stated my opinion. I feel like I understand yours and hoped others might at leat see where I am coming from. Alas, it is obvious without me going back to the archives, that this topic has been battled over in the past. I'm letting it go. I don't feel like I have slammed or even bad mouthed anyone, that is not my intention. I did not intend to start off over here on a bad note. And no, baiting is not legal in Illinois. Heck, if that wacko governor has his way hunting won't be either... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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