VermontHunter Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 You mean every driver was an accomplished college football or baseball player? I am sure some might be able to do it but not many. How many drivers actually fit where accomplished college players? Not every ... and you know exactly what Im trying to say,, so stop the nit picking.. I can use that aspect on you too ,,, every PRO player can drive a 800 hp. 3500lb. car 180 mph. week in and week out and be competative to the point he wins more than he wrecks..?? Remember you first have to find that PRO with the guts to even attempt round 1 with one of these cars... All you guys have to do is look up the profiles of some of these guys driving these race cars... you may be pleasently suprised in what you find... I'm truely starting to feel out numbered here and quick... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddyboman Posted July 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 You missed my last sentence where I asked "HOW MANY" drivers fit that mold. I could look up the info on these guys but I have you a fan right here and could help me out with those that were accomplished college athletes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Finn Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 Isn't Jeff Gordon like 5'7" and 150 pounds? Which sport did he excel at? You may be outnumbered because the rest of the guys see the light (that's for my corn and ribs) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 Isn't Jeff Gordon like 5'7" and 150 pounds? Which sport did he excel at? You may be outnumbered because the rest of the guys see the light (that's for my corn and ribs) Actually Craig,, Jeff has always driven cars not sure if he ever even went to college...:D...;) Let me see what I can dig up on a few drivers... While I'm doing that you guy's dig up the numbers on just how many other so called athletes drove race cars successfully ... I think I'm on a sinking ship here.... but let me ask this one then ,, from what Im understanding here is a Pro Baseball player (accordding to your analogy) can successfully adapt to playing Pro Football or Pro Hockey because he's an athelete ?? .. Go figure... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddyboman Posted July 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 I think I'm on a sinking ship here You know how to swim right.:D If not I got a life jacket for ya. Actually we just was stating that a pro baseball, football, basketball,hockey player, and so on could adapt to driving in NASCAR easier than a NASCAR driver could adapt to playing one of their sports. You just added the other part from what Im understanding here is a Pro Baseball player (accordding to your analogy) can successfully adapt to playing Pro Football or Pro Hockey because he's an athelete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 OK before I totally conceed to this debate let me offer this article for you reading enjoyment, PLEASE read it, it's real good.. Are NASCAR Drivers Athletes? What makes someone an athlete? Is being physically fit required for athleticism? Do you have to be physically fit and coordinated to be a NASCAR driver? What is the difference between sports and games? Here’s one answer from a young philosopher. Christopher THE QUESTION of the week is: “Are NASCAR drivers athletes?” This week, our guest artist and philosopher is Christopher. Chris is a very thoughtful, kind, and considerate 10 year old, who lives in St. James, Long Island and Silver Beach , the Bronx . Although he can be very serious, Chris also has a fabulous sense of humor. He is a 5 th grader at Mills Pond Elementary School in St. James. His teacher is Mr. Thornton. Christopher’s favorite subjects are math and social studies. He loves to play all sports, especially baseball, football, and hockey. He also likes to watch sports. In the summer, he enjoys going to Yankee Stadium with his dad to watch the Yankees play baseball. His favorite football team is the New York Giants. His favorite hockey team is the New York Rangers. And, his favorite baseball team is the New York Yankees. Chris likes watching movies too. Recent favorites include “Remember the Titans” and “ Madagascar .” The question Chris took on is: Are NASCAR drivers athletes? My discussion with Chris was the most in-depth interview, thus far, with THE QUESTION. We talked for over one hour, and we could have gone on for much longer. Chris defended the view that NASCAR drivers are athletes. Simply put, his argument for his conclusion is that NASCAR is clearly a professional sport. All people who play professional sports are athletes. Therefore, NASCAR drivers are athletes. Chris skillfully defended his view from several objections. One objection I raised for him is the following objection. “In order to qualify as an athlete, a person must demonstrate physical agility, be coordinated, and be in good physical condition. Driving a racing car requires none of these qualifications. Therefore, NASCAR Drivers do not qualify as athletes.” Chris had two responses. Chris maintained that these standards are probably too high. According to these standards, many golfers, football players, baseball players, etc. would probably not count as athletes. But, according to Chris, they obviously should count as athletes. Chris also pointed out that driving a race car for hundreds of miles does require enormous stamina, physical fitness, coordination, and a reasonable amount of agility. So, even if those standards were appropriate, NASCAR drivers could all easily pass the test. Driving a race car does not require the sort of aerobic fitness required for marathoners, but Chris pointed out that different sports require different types of physical fitness. For example, a linebacker needs to be strong and agile. He would not need to have the aerobic capacity to run a marathon. A marathoner needs the capacity to run 26.5 miles, quickly. However, she does not need to be able to stop a 500+ lb. stampede of football players. Marathoners tend to be lightweight and thin. Being lightweight and thin helps marathoners excel in their sport. Being thin and lightweight would not be much help to a linebacker. In fact, being thin and lightweight would be a great disadvantage to a linebacker. One need not be light and thin or be of linebacker strength to be an excellent race car driver, but one does need to be in “car driving physical shape” to be a NASCAR driver. Drivers need to be able to withstand the physical challenges of dealing with extreme heat and the challenge of physically handling a race car going over one hundred miles per hour. NASCAR drivers need extremely sharp reflexes, endurance, courage, and split-second decision making skills. Another objection Chris considered against his own view is this one: “If NASCAR drivers are athletes, then so are all chess players. But, clearly not all chess players are athletes. Therefore, NASCAR drivers are not athletes.” Chris’s response to this attack on the athleticism of NASCAR drivers is that “Unlike NASCAR driving, Chess does not require any kind of physical fitness, physical strength, or physical coordination (other than what is required to move a chess piece.)” Chris also stressed his simple, original, argument, which is that people who play sports (at a certain level) are athletes. He did not say that people who play games are athletes. Since chess is a game, but not a sport, he would not be stuck with the conclusion that chess players are athletes. Chris is only stuck with the conclusion that all people who play professional sports are athletes, and he is happy to be stuck with this conclusion. FYI: Chris’s brother, Kyle, was chiming in throughout the interview. When we were discussing the chess objection, Kyle maintained that the World Chess Championship should count as a sporting event. It should count as a sport that requires absolutely no athleticism. With this comment, Kyle raised an interesting objection to Chris’s claim that anyone who plays a professional sport is an athlete. Of course, now we have a new philosophical question: When is a game a sport?”) There's some other interesting comments from other folks also,,, so I'll leave you with the link also .. http://thequestion.blogs.wvu.edu/questions/2006/12/20/are-nascar-drivers-athletes- I give up ,,,, I surrender ,,, this is a loosing battle with you guy's ... :p Hey, Chris doe's this mean I get corn too ?? PLEASE .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Finn Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 too many words for me....got the Reader's Digest version? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 too many words for me....got the Reader's Digest version? SORRY !! I couldn't find the Finnish version .. :D Read it Craig,, this kid is way smarter than me ... He's good .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Finn Posted July 11, 2007 Report Share Posted July 11, 2007 I can certainly see his views as being valid. My thoughts are simply these: In an athletic event/sport, the athlete the who performs the best, barring something unusual, wins. In racing, the winner is the person who makes his/her car perform the best. I also feel Secretariat was the athlete, not the jockey. A driver makes a car perform. While it certainly takes ability to do so, the car is performing and is more important than the driver to the success in this event. But, I can certainly see the other side. Have a good night, Luke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdvantageTimberLou Posted July 12, 2007 Report Share Posted July 12, 2007 Clueless, that is what people are when it comes to the "sport" of auto racing. You have no idea what its like to drive that car or crew on one. Tons of hours get spent working on them and your not seeing 300 lb crewmen changing tires in 13 seconds. Your seeing athletic guys driving them and crewing for them. Don't care what you say, racing is a sport and more it more talent to drive than you think. Beat up Luke and I but we know better, SPORT!! I guess until Muggs becomes a fan of it, it will never get that status on here. Go play baseball or football, I guess the real sports as you see fit!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted July 12, 2007 Report Share Posted July 12, 2007 Wow...I leave for the night and you guys get into this over analysis??? This arguement is cut-and-dry boys........................................................................................................................and it is................................................................................................................. NASCAR stinks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdvantageTimberLou Posted July 12, 2007 Report Share Posted July 12, 2007 Wow...I leave for the night and you guys get into this over analysis??? This arguement is cut-and-dry boys........................................................................................................................and it is................................................................................................................. NASCAR stinks. I'll give you that Muggs, they have ruined it, from what it once was but still its a great sport that involves a certain amount of athleticism. Luke was being beaten like a red headed step child on this last night and where was Lou to help him out? I was working on the race car last night getting ready for a race tomorrow night! Sorry Luke!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckbuster11 Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 LMAO!! I leave you clowns for a week and look what you done started without me. Is Nascar a sport? I don't really consider it one. Keep in mind I know very little about it but, the thing that takes away from it for me is it's way more about the car then the driver. You never hear, "Oh Dale Jr. had one of the worst cars in the race and still won". Doesnt happen. The best cars win most of the time regardless of driver talent. Why is Jr. going to Hendricks? That's the best team with the best cars right now eh? It seems to me the races are really by the guys in the pits put the cars together, not really the drivers. BTW---I'm not picking on Jr. Just using him as an example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohiobucks Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 When does huntin' season hit? :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 When are you people going to get it ?? .... :rolleyes: It's called ... MOTOR SPORTS ,, now say it with me ,,, MOTOR SPORTS .. Where the cars are featured as the sport, and the drivers and crews are the ATHELETE'S .. Sheeesh, people get it right will ya... :D:D Deer Hunting, here in Vermont starts the first Sat. in October .. :D Got ways to go yet ... :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddyboman Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Is Nascar a sport? Actually this started as "WHAT IS A SPORT?" Golf,fishing, hunting, cheerleading, NASCAR, billards, and so on. However for some reason it quickly went to is NASCAR a sport. We have had a lot of fun with it. Hey Luke did you ever find out which drivers where accomplished college athletes? I have looked but can't seem to find much about there past just current stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 So Luke, are you saying it's not a sport, but it is a MOTOR sport? I'm happy to see you finally seeing the light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Actually this started as "WHAT IS A SPORT?" Golf,fishing, hunting, cheerleading, NASCAR, billards, and so on. However for some reason it quickly went to is NASCAR a sport. We have had a lot of fun with it. Hey Luke did you ever find out which drivers where accomplished college athletes? I have looked but can't seem to find much about there past just current stuff. Nope ,, I hit the same wall you did ... :( ,, it's NOT just the drivers tho, you have to look at the pit crew as well .. guess you'll just have to take my word for it.. ;) And I thought we were all on the same page when we were talking about NASCAR or any other type of vehicle racing.... They are called MOTOR SPORTS sorry, if I gave a different impression ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddyboman Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Nope ,, I hit the same wall you did ... :( ,, it's NOT just the drivers tho, you have to look at the pit crew as well .. guess you'll just have to take my word for it.. ;) Well shucks. I was curious about that. I didnt realize you was talking about pit crew people too. Heck most of those guys not really that well known so their info would be very hard to find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddyboman Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Not to beat a dead horse, but this is interesting IMO. Since some think NASCAR is a sport does that mean that you also think that the Driver, ALL the Pit Crew, and THE Car are all athletes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 You have to agree Todd, that it's a TEAM SPORT ,, without the pitcrew the driver hasn't much of a chance and vise-versa .. They go hand in hand, much like the quarterback in football, the pitcher in baseball, and the goalie in hockey .. they aren't much without the rest of the TEAM .. NASCAR is a MOTOR SPORT and the drivers and crews are the ATHELET'S ... No matter how hard some may try to tak the word SPORT out of it.... it just can't be done... IMHO a SPORT is anything that requires COMPITITION...;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 OK, I've got a compromise we can all agree on and finally settle this debate. Firstly, from this day forward, we'll agree to refer to the drivers as athLEASTS. Then, we'll all agree that driving a car is not a "sport" in the truest sense of the word, but it's actually a MOTOR sport and since we need to add another word in front of "sport" for further clarification, we should all feel assurred that we're not the fist ones to belive it's not a "sport." K? **Important notes for your consideration** Baseball doesn't need to be specified as a "ball" or "bat" sport, nor does football have to be referred to as a "running" or "throwing" sport. This is because, everyone knows, those are just "sports." Also, Nascar sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 OK, I've got a compromise we can all agree on and finally settle this debate. Firstly, from this day forward, we'll agree to refer to the drivers as athLEASTS. Then, we'll all agree that driving a car is not a "sport" in the truest sense of the word, but it's actually a MOTOR sport and since we need to add another word in front of "sport" for further clarification, we should all feel assurred that we're not the fist ones to belive it's not a "sport." K? **Important notes for your consideration** Baseball doesn't need to be specified as a "ball" or "bat" sport, nor does football have to be referred to as a "running" or "throwing" sport. This is because, everyone knows, those are just "sports." Also, Nascar sucks. Muggs, don't make me come over there .... :p:p It's a sport, there's NO debate ... this is just FACT .. :D Now relax and have a beer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Muggs, don't make me come over there .... :p:p It's a sport, there's NO debate ... this is just FACT .. :D Now relax and have a beer... You plan on coming over, you better pack a lunch.... but, we're OK on the drivers as athLEASTS though?:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 OH you're a very funny man ther Muggs .. :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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