horst Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 My 11 year old cousin has recently had open heart surgery for the second time.He has recovered pretty well and is capable of hunting but the recoil from his 20 guage and even his dads muzzleloader hurt his incision and hes very leary of shooting them. After opening weekend since his dad works till past dark I took over taking him out and the first thing I did was try to get him a gun and load he could shoot comfortably.I have a CVA wolf and it fits him better then the other guns, after a little screwing around we got him shooting about 75 grains of 777 with a 185 grain saboted bullet.He can hit very well with it and was shooting stationary clay pigeons at a liuttle over 40 yrds sighting it in.My question is with a load trhis light how do I figure out the maximum range it is safe to shoot at a deer with and still kill it?Im gonna keep his shots at under 30 yards anyway since where we hunt its about the farthest you can see anyway but am curious as to the loads effectiveness out farther. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Dont know Chris, might try shooting at water filled milk jugs at a max distance you expect him to have opportunities for shots and check for penetration and expansion of the bullet recovered from the jug. The kid would not have to be the shooter shooting at the jugs necessarily either, but would be fun practice. Would think 3-4 water filled jugs lined up with that load should be enough at 75 yards to stop the bullet. Would think if the bullet expands well, and makes it into the third jug or further it should be retaining plenty of energy and have ample penetration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdhunter39 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 when my father had open heart sergury at the age of 53 , i bought him a 410 shotgun , a few years later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I like the water jug idea, I may try that this weekend. bird hunter, thought of that but 410 slugs are illegal to hunt with here on deer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gt2003 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Horst, I bet you will be alright for deer at that distance. I use 80 grains of 777 and a 220 grain dead center, all lead bullet. Most of my shots are under 50 yards and I haven't had any trouble at all. The only concern I would have might be using a jacketed bullet. You might consider going with something like a precision rifle all lead bullet. They expand incredibly well and I'm sure they would do the job. Good luck and let us know what you decide. Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted October 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 GT, thanks for the input.I went with these because season was almost over and dad had these on hand.The selection for ML bullets is pretty sad around here and its hard to find anything under 250 grain.I have 3 more kid to take hunting yet this year, two of which have never killed a deer before so Ill start shopping around online for some different bullets.Im open to suggestions, thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 Horst, I bet you will be alright for deer at that distance. I use 80 grains of 777 and a 220 grain dead center, all lead bullet. Most of my shots are under 50 yards and I haven't had any trouble at all. The only concern I would have might be using a jacketed bullet. You might consider going with something like a precision rifle all lead bullet. They expand incredibly well and I'm sure they would do the job. Good luck and let us know what you decide. Greg Horst, I have something similar to this. I shoot 80 gr. of Pyrodex and a 348 gr powerbelts out of my TC Renegade. I have shot 80gr. of powder for about 20 years. I found it was the perfect load for my gun. I started with round balls then moved up to maxi slugs then powerbelts. All with 80 gr. of powder and it has killed a lot of deer. One thing to mention is that all of these deer were less than 100 yards because I have iron sights. I'm not sure what kind of range you want but my loads work awesome for me. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gt2003 Posted October 5, 2007 Report Share Posted October 5, 2007 Horst, Try www.prbullet.com or check out the cabelas website. Cabelas has the dead centers but they call them the cabelas dead center sabots (all lead bullet with an orange sabot). I ordered mine from them and they are exactly like the 1st one I ordered from the precision rifle website. Good luck and let us know what you end up with and how it works. Thanks, Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bow_hunter101 Posted October 5, 2007 Report Share Posted October 5, 2007 I would suggest eventually buying a .45 caliber muzzeloader. It's gonna kick alot less and is often considered a youth gun (not trying to offend anyone who uses a .45!). That way you can shoot less powder and could use a 175 grain bullet (http://www.powerbeltbullets.com/copper.html). Not to mention the smaller barrel is gonna shoot alot farther with less powder than a .50 would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcwa Posted October 6, 2007 Report Share Posted October 6, 2007 What about a shoulder recoil pad like this one. http://www.basspro.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_-1_10001_49728_400004008_400000000_400004000_400-4-8 It may be enough padding to reduce the recoil for him to shoot 100gr of power with out hurting him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted October 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 Thanks for the input guys, Im not gonna have these kids shooting much past 30 yrds, it was more curiosity on my part than anything about the range these were good at.Ive actually got my cousins kid coming over to practice tommorrow with it, hes in 6th grade and hopefully next weekend i can get him his first deer, hopefully we will get a chance to mess around with it and see what they do at longer ranges. Jcwa, I dont think that pad will work for my other cousin, the buckle would appear to be right where his incision is in his chest and I dont think it would be comfortable for him.We put a recoil pad on the gun already which helped a lot. Kinda funny but these kids all wanted to hunt this year and i agreed to take several of them, I havent got a license myself yet and may not even get to if my oldest boy decides to try bowhunting, Ive had more fun taking them then I usually do hunting myself so far Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnf Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 I shoot a 250gr. Shock-wave with 83gr. of 777 behind it. Last year I shot a doe at 183 yards. I aimed about 8" above the point of impact. I had a clean pass-through and the exit was about the size of a 50 cent piece. The doe ran about 35 yards before expiring, and gave me a very obvious blood trail through the brush. I'm guessing your in pretty good shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnf Posted October 7, 2007 Report Share Posted October 7, 2007 I shoot a 250gr. Shock-wave with 83gr. of 777 behind it. Last year I shot a doe at 183 yards. I aimed about 8" above the point of impact. I had a clean pass-through and the exit was about the size of a 50 cent piece. The doe ran about 35 yards before expiring, and gave me a very obvious blood trail through the brush. I'm guessing your in pretty good shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganHunter Posted October 11, 2007 Report Share Posted October 11, 2007 Not sure if you have come up with a solution yet but lots of good ideas out there, .410 slugs are not illegal here in Michigan, my neighbors kid hunts with on and dropped a seven point last year, I dont know your money situation is, if u want to look for a new gun or improve the one u got, new guns-I just bought a T.C. Encore "Pro Hunter" it has built in vibration dampeners and i shoot 100 grain and 200 grain bullet and u dont know it is kicking, A .410 slug gun would be a great gun.....Improving your gun-Limbsaver recoil pad, i have one on a .308 and it REALLY reduces the recoil, it's deff worth the money........I hope u can find something that works for him and you, and I cant wait to see the pics of his deer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnf Posted October 12, 2007 Report Share Posted October 12, 2007 Here's another thought http://www.rossiusa.com/products/product-details.cfm?model=S45YBM&category=MUZZLELOADER http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/default.php?cPath=15146_15087_15117 That looks like a great deal to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horst Posted October 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2007 John, thanks for the link, Im gonna show his dad that .45 caliber Rossi in stainless, looks like a vero good price to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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