Tom2008 Posted February 4, 2008 Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 This is the PSE X-Force SS HF at 26 5/8 inches axle to axle. And you all thought 30 was short. I've shot this one and it actually is a really smooth and easy pulling bow for the size. Oh and did I mention very very quick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M00N Posted February 4, 2008 Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 Nice, but I like to keep my bows atleast 30" ATA just incase for some miracle I'd shoot a record deer sometime I'd hate to be disqualified from Pope and Young for going under their 30" bow length rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutchies Posted February 4, 2008 Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 Not saying it won't shoot well. The longer ATA tends to hold better and you don't have to worry as much about nock pinch. Alot of guys shooting 31 in ATA if they have a longer DL like 30 are alot more likely to have nock pinch even with a d loop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LIVEWIRE Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Not saying it won't shoot well. The longer ATA tends to hold better and you don't have to worry as much about nock pinch. Alot of guys shooting 31 in ATA if they have a longer DL like 30 are alot more likely to have nock pinch even with a d loop. ultra nock should work with that short bow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ohbowhntr Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 I can't imagine that thing could be very forgiving. As a matter of fact, I'd bet it would be anything but, and likely would be a bow you surely wouldn't want to creep any at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2008 Posted February 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 It actually is really forgiving for how small it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HUNTINGMAN Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Did not know pope and young had a minimum ATA length,this is something I have learned today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowtechTurkeyHunter Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 I can't imagine that thing could be very forgiving. As a matter of fact, I'd bet it would be anything but, and likely would be a bow you surely wouldn't want to creep any at all. Actually the ATA is irrellevent pretty much if you have a brace hieght to make up for the difference ... http://www.pse-archery.com/prod.php?k=57248&u=0808HF There are the specs for the PSE Here are the specs for Whisper Creeks Stealth ... http://www.whispercreekarchery.com/Products/stealthlx.htm The biggest difference I can see is the brace height and of course the IBO ... just saying the ATA isnt the deciding factor in a bow as far as forgivness and ease of shooting ... As far as the 30" rule here yah go P&Y deffinition of a bow http://www.pope-young.org/Definition.asp VERY clear what is says there. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ohbowhntr Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Actually the ATA is irrellevent pretty much if you have a brace hieght to make up for the difference ... Not in the world I live in, plus the BH on that thing is ONLY 7 1/16", not sure I've ever seen one measured down to the 1/16 of an inch, but I'm sure that's their attempt to make it seem longer than just 7". Computation: Our rating was originally designed on a 100 point scale, but several designs the last few years have broken our ceiling (100+). For our rating......Brace height is the biggest consideration - followed by axle-to-axle length - and finally IBO speed (minor consideration). The math is fairly simple Forgiveness= (1.5a + 7.8b) - (s/10) where a=Axle Length, b=Brace Height, and s=IBO Speed. Larger brace heights, longer axle-to-axle lengths, and moderate IBO speed bows score higher. For 2005, scores range from 64 to 112, with 64 being the least-forgiving design. Bows without a legitimate IBO Speed (youth bows, short-draw bows, bows not capable of 70# peak weight, etc.) are not rated. Parallel Limb Bonus Points: As parallel limb bows have become more and more popular, we often hear the argument that parallel limb bows are somewhat more forgiving. First, because they tend to be heavier and more stable at full draw. But also because they tend to have much less forward limb thrust, noise, and recoil, so shooters tend to settle into a more relaxed shot sequence with less anticipation of a violent release. While most experts aren't convinced this is true (at least not yet), we think there is some merit to the argument. As such, for 2007 we have amended our formula and have awarded true parallel limb bows with 3 forgiveness bonus points. Though, it isn't a perfect formula, I believe it's pretty accurate based on some of the stuff I've shot. So, let's see here, (A-to-A x 1.5 is 26.625 x 1.5 = 39.94) + (BH x 7.8 so 7.0625 x 7.8 = 55.1) - (Speed / 10 so 330/10 = 33) 39.94 + 55.1 = 95.04 - 33 = 62.04. Now that would make this bow the LEAST forgiving they've ever rated, unless something else slide in there lower this year. So to say "the ATA is irrelevant" is pretty silly IMHO. That Whisper Creek Sweet Demise, would rate much higher on the HF forgiveness scale, 73.84, giving it the extra 3 points, because it certainly seems to be a Parallel limb design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ohbowhntr Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Actually the ATA is irrellevent pretty much if you have a brace hieght to make up for the difference ... Not in the world I live in, plus the BH on that thing is ONLY 7 1/16", not sure I've ever seen one measured down to the 1/16 of an inch, but I'm sure that's their attempt to make it seem longer than just 7". Computation: Our rating was originally designed on a 100 point scale, but several designs the last few years have broken our ceiling (100+). For our rating......Brace height is the biggest consideration - followed by axle-to-axle length - and finally IBO speed (minor consideration). The math is fairly simple Forgiveness= (1.5a + 7.8b) - (s/10) where a=Axle Length, b=Brace Height, and s=IBO Speed. Larger brace heights, longer axle-to-axle lengths, and moderate IBO speed bows score higher. For 2005, scores range from 64 to 112, with 64 being the least-forgiving design. Bows without a legitimate IBO Speed (youth bows, short-draw bows, bows not capable of 70# peak weight, etc.) are not rated. Parallel Limb Bonus Points NEW: As parallel limb bows have become more and more popular, we often hear the argument that parallel limb bows are somewhat more forgiving. First, because they tend to be heavier and more stable at full draw. But also because they tend to have much less forward limb thrust, noise, and recoil, so shooters tend to settle into a more relaxed shot sequence with less anticipation of a violent release. While most experts aren't convinced this is true (at least not yet), we think there is some merit to the argument. As such, for 2007 we have amended our formula and have awarded true parallel limb bows with 3 forgiveness bonus points. Though, it isn't a perfect formula, I believe it's pretty accurate based on some of the stuff I've shot. So, let's see here, (A-to-A x 1.5 is 26.625 x 1.5 = 39.94) + (BH x 7.8 so 7.0625 x 7.8 = 55.1) - (Speed / 10 so 330/10 = 33) 39.94 + 55.1 = 95.04 - 33 = 62.04. Now that would make this bow the LEAST forgiving they've ever rated, unless something else slide in there lower this year. So to say "the ATA matters little" is pretty silly IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2008 Posted February 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Not in the world I live in, plus the BH on that thing is ONLY 7 1/16", not sure I've ever seen one measured down to the 1/16 of an inch, but I'm sure that's their attempt to make it seem longer than just 7". Though, it isn't a perfect formula, I believe it's pretty accurate based on some of the stuff I've shot. So, let's see here, (A-to-A x 1.5 is 26.625 x 1.5 = 39.94) + (BH x 7.8 so 7.0625 x 7.8 = 55.1) - (Speed / 10 so 330/10 = 33) 39.94 + 55.1 = 95.04 - 33 = 62.04. Now that would make this bow the LEAST forgiving they've ever rated, unless something else slide in there lower this year. So to say "the ATA is irrelevant" is pretty silly IMHO. That Whisper Creek Sweet Demise, would rate much higher on the HF forgiveness scale, 73.84, giving it the extra 3 points, because it certainly seems to be a Parallel limb design. Well I don't care what the numbers say. I've shot the bow myself and it is forgiving. Just as forgiving as my 33 inch ATA and 7 inch brace height Iron Mace. Numbers can't prove what a person feels in a bow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ohbowhntr Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Well I don't care what the numbers say. I've shot the bow myself and it is forgiving. Just as forgiving as my 33 inch ATA and 7 inch brace height Iron Mace. Numbers can't prove what a person feels in a bow. Tom, If you like it, more power to ya, you're probably a far better archer than myself, because I'm not real sure I'd shoot something that short worth a darn. But there certainly IS something to the numbers, as well as the speed, but I agree, it really comes down to "personal feel," because if a bow doesn't feel right in my hand, I'm not likely gonna shoot it well regardless of how "forgiving" it's supposed to be. You're still pretty young, once you've been around archery for 15-20yrs, some of those ideals may change a bit. I've certainly changed a fair amount over the last several years, as I believe we all do, and change is healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2008 Posted February 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Well I'm at 10 years so I'm getting there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 A 7" brace height is absolutely as small as I can stand with a 31" draw. Also considering my draw length. A bow with an ATA less then my draw has always been a challenge to shoot for me. Perhaps some PSE magic would make this bow work for me. I don't know. I'd sure have to try before I buy. That's a guarantee! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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