johnf Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pir-etUBKKU How can someone defend or vote for a man who who could justify this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 Did not watch all of your link yet John, will have to check back a little later. Obama's latest comment on abortion as far as I am aware was at the Saddleback Church in reply to this question from pastor Rick Warren "At what point is a baby entitled to human rights?" this was the reply in Obama's own words "I think that whether you're looking at it from a theological perspective or a scientific perspective, answering that question with specificity, you know, is above my pay grade." Rather than answering the question at that point, he avoided all together with a pretty poor reply. "Above his pay grade"?????:confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKYhunter Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 That alone is enough for me not to vote for him, let alone everything else. How anyone can support this is beyond me. I hope to see this challenged in the SCOTUS soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andrea Posted August 21, 2008 Report Share Posted August 21, 2008 He's an idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
struttinhoyt Posted August 22, 2008 Report Share Posted August 22, 2008 I really dislike that guy.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKYhunter Posted August 22, 2008 Report Share Posted August 22, 2008 Did anyone see the story last night about osama voting AGAINST a bill in the Illinois legislature that would require treatment for babies who survive an attempted abortion? To me that's just cold blooded! I wish McCain would use the audio from that vote in a commercial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andrea Posted August 22, 2008 Report Share Posted August 22, 2008 Anti-christ......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gator Posted August 22, 2008 Report Share Posted August 22, 2008 Anti-christ......... Geez Andrea, tell us how you REALLY feel, don't hold back!!!:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnf Posted August 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2008 Did anyone see the story last night about osama voting AGAINST a bill in the Illinois legislature that would require treatment for babies who survive an attempted abortion? To me that's just cold blooded! I wish McCain would use the audio from that vote in a commercial. That's what the video is about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireStrut Posted August 24, 2008 Report Share Posted August 24, 2008 What a loser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flintlock1776 Posted August 24, 2008 Report Share Posted August 24, 2008 Lets see what the dope that is his VP choice will say. He is supposed to be a Catholic from Scranton, PA. That is a pretty conservative area. Will he follow Obama's lead and forgo his background or did his conveniently toss that out years ago so he's going to support Obma's stupidity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lead Poison Posted August 24, 2008 Report Share Posted August 24, 2008 Make no mistake, Barack Obama's an evil man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stringpicker Posted August 25, 2008 Report Share Posted August 25, 2008 I could not agree more with you guys about how socialist, one world government, pro-war, pro-murder (abortion), unconstituional, (the list goes on) Obama is. In the same sentence with all those you have to include McCain in that sentence as well. I am more worried if McCain gets in because people really believe that McCain really is better than Obama, because he is a GOP candidate. People think that they are doing America a favor by voting for McCain, but really they have the same stands on issues and neither one of them has a solution to any of our country's problems. He is pro-murder (abortion): McCain told the Chronicle. ''But certainly in the short term, or even the long term, I would not support the repeal of Roe v. Wade, which would then force ... women in America to illegal and dangerous operations.'' http://graphics.boston.com/news/politics/campaign2000/news/Rift_within_GOP_is_widening_over_issue_of_abortion +.shtml he is for gun control (check out why the Gun Owners of America gave him an F-rating) http://gunowners.org/pres08/mccain.htm he is for the war (which was not voted on by congress, which is unconstitutional ) he is for big government (also unconstituional), he is for wrecking the economy by doing absolutly nothing (ending the war and bringing ALL troops from ALL countries home and keep them here would save billions of dollars DAILY! Did you know we have troops in 130 different countires? No that is not a misprint). The real way to solve the problems with the economy is not to cut taxes and tax in other areas. The real solution is to abolish the Federal Reserve, which makes money out of thin air with no backing whatsoever. Money used to be backed by gold and silver, but now it backed by nothing but lies and greed from self-serving politicians.If you would like to see a working, simple, and constituional solution to our country's problem go to www.ronpaul.com. He ran for president but was snubbed by everyone, because it was not who the super elite wanted in office. If you are looking for a candidate that will be on the ticket in November check out Chuck Baldwin at www.baldwin08.com . He is running for the constituional party candidate. He is not like the candidates that keep producing the same embrassing headlines day after day.Most importantly this country was founded on Godly principles that we have wandered far from. We, as a country need to get back to God. Sorry for the long post, but people need to know. James www.baldwin08.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted August 25, 2008 Report Share Posted August 25, 2008 I could not agree more with you guys about how socialist, one world government, pro-war, pro-murder (abortion), unconstituional, (the list goes on) Obama is. In the same sentence with all those you have to include McCain in that sentence as well. I am more worried if McCain gets in because people really believe that McCain really is better than Obama, because he is a GOP candidate. People think that they are doing America a favor by voting for McCain, but really they have the same stands on issues and neither one of them has a solution to any of our country's problems. He is pro-murder (abortion): McCain told the Chronicle. ''But certainly in the short term, or even the long term, I would not support the repeal of Roe v. Wade, which would then force ... women in America to illegal and dangerous operations.'' http://graphics.boston.com/news/politics/campaign2000/news/Rift_within_GOP_is_widening_over_issue_of_abortion +.shtml he is for gun control (check out why the Gun Owners of America gave him an F-rating) http://gunowners.org/pres08/mccain.htm he is for the war (which was not voted on by congress, which is unconstitutional ) he is for big government (also unconstituional), he is for wrecking the economy by doing absolutly nothing (ending the war and bringing ALL troops from ALL countries home and keep them here would save billions of dollars DAILY! Did you know we have troops in 130 different countires? No that is not a misprint). The real way to solve the problems with the economy is not to cut taxes and tax in other areas. The real solution is to abolish the Federal Reserve, which makes money out of thin air with no backing whatsoever. Money used to be backed by gold and silver, but now it backed by nothing but lies and greed from self-serving politicians.If you would like to see a working, simple, and constituional solution to our country's problem go to www.ronpaul.com. He ran for president but was snubbed by everyone, because it was not who the super elite wanted in office. If you are looking for a candidate that will be on the ticket in November check out Chuck Baldwin at www.baldwin08.com . He is running for the constituional party candidate. He is not like the candidates that keep producing the same embrassing headlines day after day.Most importantly this country was founded on Godly principles that we have wandered far from. We, as a country need to get back to God. Sorry for the long post, but people need to know. James Since this cut and paste reply was posted in three different threads including in this room, it would probably be best to pick one to debate it in and remove the other two. This one may well be as fitting as any so here it will stay. I think most conservative voters would probably agree that McCain was not their first choice, however he is in my opinion on the issues that matter to me a better (less liberal) choice than the alternative whether he has an "F" rating from gun owners of America or any other source. Seems there are some inconsistent or uncertainties around McCains remarks and voting on gun control issues depending on the source as well. According to his voting record and comments here http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/john_mccain_gun_control.htm, I think some of what he has to says makes some sense, and looking at the record on voting it does not look like he is what I would really consider a "gun grabber". Obama's short and clear record can be seen here http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/Barack_Obama_Gun_Control.htm. I just do not see these two candidates as being all that similar, not on gun control, or abortion, or several other issues that are important at this point in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldksnarc Posted August 26, 2008 Report Share Posted August 26, 2008 Anti-christ......... Ditto.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texan_Til_I_Die Posted August 26, 2008 Report Share Posted August 26, 2008 ...he is for the war (which was not voted on by congress, which is unconstitutional )... Oops! Better do a fact check before posting. On October 10, 2002 the House passed a resolution allowing the use of military force against Iraq, and on the following day, October 11, the Senate also passed the joint resolution. http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2002/roll455.xml http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=107&vote=00237&session=2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted August 26, 2008 Report Share Posted August 26, 2008 Oops! Better do a fact check before posting. On October 10, 2002 the House passed a resolution allowing the use of military force against Iraq, and on the following day, October 11, the Senate also passed the joint resolution. http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2002/roll455.xml http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=107&vote=00237&session=2 Actually not only did congress vote on the war, but Obama's running mate Biden voted for the war only to later become a critic of the war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebeilgard Posted August 27, 2008 Report Share Posted August 27, 2008 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pir-etUBKKU How can someone defend or vote for a man who who could justify this? simple. i cannot and will not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stringpicker Posted October 22, 2008 Report Share Posted October 22, 2008 Well it has been a while since I have been posting anything, but I decided I would pull this out of the forum archives and respond to some of the posts that were put on after I posted my thoughts. First I do apologize for posting the same post 3 different times. The second thing that I would like to respond to is the post from Texan till I die. He was trying to correct me on a topic I was dicussing in my post(see his comment on the thread). He did find what appeared to be compelling evidence disproving my claim. However I did some research and now I am coming back with my findings to reconfirm what I originally posted. First in the Constitution under Article 1 Section 8 it lists the 18 (yes, only 18) powers that congress is ALLOWED to do. It does authorize them to declare war, but no where in those listed powers does it give them the power to grant a resolution as stated in the information posted by texan till i die. What texan found is a spawn from the extremely unconstitutional War Powers Act of 1973. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Powers_Resolution The danger of this is that it gives power to one man to use the military for things that he deems important. (The reason the constitution was established in the first place was to prevent one man from having all controll. It is called checks and balance system. a.k.a. accountability) And just to confirm that the only powers granted to congress, where the 18 listed, the founding fathers wrote Amendment 10, which states "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people." This means if it is not one of the 18 then they can't go and assume command of things. Our government was founded upon individuals that knew what a tyrantical government was and they wrote what they wrote to prevent that. It was based upon limited government, and INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBLITY. Read the founding fathers quotes, what they said is a replica of what is happening today. If you have not read the Constitution, you need to read it. It is the second most important writing for Americans, the first being the Bible. "How evil do the two evils have to get before people stop electing them?" James www.baldwin08.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeramie Posted October 22, 2008 Report Share Posted October 22, 2008 www.bornalivetruth.org Its about the saline abortion. Take a look. It also has the story of Obama's ties.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohiobuckhunter Posted October 22, 2008 Report Share Posted October 22, 2008 wow is about the best word i can think of after reading all of these post. i am surely not a backer of obama but i think you mcain supporters also need to step back and think of mcain idea of this issue. i mean god for bid what if your wife/girlfriend/daughter was rapped or molested? guess what whith mcain views she would have to carry that child full term caring for it. and knowing that she has no choice but to do it a complete set back to woman's rights imo. and if i was a woman i don't think i could handle that fact and would probably take a looong walk in the woods if you know what i mean. not only would you have to live with the fact of being rapped everyday you also have the additional burden of carring a child you don't want and then to have an emotional bond with the child only to give it up for adoption. like i said wow is what comes to mind when i read your views on this. i know i will hear alot of flak for this post but oh well it had to be said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnf Posted October 23, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2008 This doesn't have anything to do with abortion. This is about letting babies die. These children were born alive the chord was cut. The mothers chose to wait late into term before killing these kids. This isn't about the mothers life or health. It's about saving the life a of a live born baby. You need to watch the video before passing judgment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorden Posted October 23, 2008 Report Share Posted October 23, 2008 Says "video has been removed" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nativetexan Posted October 23, 2008 Report Share Posted October 23, 2008 Gentlemen, YouTube and Wilkepedia/Wikipedia are not valid sources of information. If you want to debate facts, please use factual sources. McCain does actually support abortions in the case of rape, incest, or the mother's life is in danger. I will leave you to find that info on your own. And if you ask me, when it comes to an abortion that does not include any of the above, my conclusion is that an abortion is absolutely a right to choose. But not a right to choose to bring a baby into this world. I view it as a choice of "stepping up to" or "getting out of" their responsibilities as a grown adult. And that my friends, is crap. We can talk religion all day long, but what it basically boils down to is the moment of conception, and what safeguards (for lack of a better term) are in place to even prevent the situation concerning an abortion from rising in the first place. Because really, a woman does have the right to choose in a consensual sexual situation what happens to her body. If she chooses to put herself in a situation where she could easily become pregnant, well then you have to pay to play. Same goes for men to. It is just as much your responsibility as a MAN to ensure the situation doesn't arise that the decision on an abortion would have to be made. So easily we loose sight of this basic responsibility as humans when our freedoms allow us to shirk responsibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeramie Posted October 23, 2008 Report Share Posted October 23, 2008 Again folks.... This isnt an abortion issue. Read the information on this link... www.bornalivetruth.org Its about a hospital that was allowing babies to choke to death after failed saline abortions. Abortion is one thing. However, if it fails and that child comes out alive they SHOULD be saved, not allowed to sit in a dirty closet and choke to death. Read the information in the link I provided. It will clear up a LOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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