iowabucks Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 I don't mind seeing Tony Stewart win, but i was kinda routing for the underdog. Regan Smith. Supposedly if you get pushed down below the yellow line you can make the pass. One of the announcers along with Smith also said there is no rule on the last lap. I believe Regan Smith should have won. I'm not faulting Tony for blocking, anybody would have done the same in that situation. And you will never see Nascar change that decision. They even put Regan in an 18th place finish. Must have given him a 1 lap penalty. Certainly if there had not been that big wreck with 14 laps to go, the race would have finished much differently. Whats your opinion? EDIT----- Sorry, i just noticed there is already a thread on this subect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 DEI won the race, tony got the W and the points. Nascar and all nascar fans know who won the race. I think they just didn't wanna hear TS cry anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowJoe Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 The rules state that even if pushed below the yellow line, you still cannot pass for position. The only reason for the exception for being pushed below the yellow is so you are not assessed a penalty for dropping below the line during green flag racing. Tony won and Tony haters are ticked that he actually followed the rules and they paid off for him. I said the moment I saw the replay that Tony was the winner. That's how it rolls at the Super Speedways. Sorry Kat, yer wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iowabucks Posted October 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 The rules also state you cannot push someone below the yellow line either. After watching some of the Nascar highlight shows today Micheal Waltrip said "if you can see the checkered flag, all yellow line rules are off". I would think in the tri oval, you could see the flagstand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABuckSlayer Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 Biffle said last night that after Nascar's decision if he's in that position he will just hold his ground and let the leader spin across his nose and wreck. That's what I would do. I think it was a dumb call and as far as I'm concerned Regan Smith won that race. Doesn't matter though... I've pretty much lost interest in Nascar now. I'll finish out my fantasy league this year and then I'll be pretty much done as a Nascar fan! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 BowJoe said: The rules state that even if pushed below the yellow line, you still cannot pass for position. The only reason for the exception for being pushed below the yellow is so you are not assessed a penalty for dropping below the line during green flag racing. Tony won and Tony haters are ticked that he actually followed the rules and they paid off for him. I said the moment I saw the replay that Tony was the winner. That's how it rolls at the Super Speedways. Sorry Kat, yer wrong. If we use your temonalogy of the rule then Tony should have bee blacked flag as well ,,, as it states in the rule book.... you even stated yourself that Tony pushed the 01 below the yellow line .. ;) and as it states in the rule book — a driver is allowed to make the pass if officials believe he was forced under the line . Tony himself even admitted he blocked the 01 below the line in an interview, so who blew what ?? ... :confused: http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081006/SPORTS09/810060326/1002/RSS02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randyman Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 I did not see the race or any replays. If Regan Smith was behind Tony when he went below the Yellow line and did it to avoid hitting him in the rear, then he was not forced below the line. On the other hand, if the 01 car was beside Tony and the 20 car literally forced him sideways below the yellow line, then Nascar blew it. All i know is, i won $200 in the Nascar pool at work when the 20 car won, so thank you Nascar! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrud Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 This shouldn't even have to be discussed. Regan Smith blew his chance to win the race. Smith had his teammate behind him the last three laps. With the single file line of cars, there is no reason the 01 and 15 shouldn't have been able to get by the 20. Stewart was on the yellow line the entire backstretch. You can't tell me that the 15 would have left the 01 out by himself and went with Tony. Smith and Menard had three laps to get around Stewart and for some reason waited until the last couple hundred yards. Makes no sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 Bowjoe-read the rules, then watch the race, then tell me I'm wrong. The rules read that you can pass on last lap if forced below the line. Smith was forced, it's obvious, your blind if you can't see it. He made the pass legally according to the rules NASCAR set. Now if tony hadn't confessed to trying to run smith down low then I would see your point possibly. But I seen him push him down, and I heard him, and read quotes from him, saying he meant to push smith down below the yellow to save his win. I think tony is a big fat baby, but I could care less honestly if he won, or if smith won. To me they are equal in my fan standings. BUT, the fact of the matter is Regan Smith got screwed and lost a win due to Nascar bending their own rules. Ironically it's for another Toyota driver. I find it to be BS, and you my friend are the one who is wrong. Do your research and then get back to me..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfoot22 Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 VABuckSlayer said: Biffle said last night that after Nascar's decision if he's in that position he will just hold his ground and let the leader spin across his nose and wreck. That's what I would do. I think it was a dumb call and as far as I'm concerned Regan Smith won that race. Doesn't matter though... I've pretty much lost interest in Nascar now. I'll finish out my fantasy league this year and then I'll be pretty much done as a Nascar fan! I'm with you on being done with NASCAR.It's been a big bore this year.I know I seen JR. make that same move a few years ago and they let him slide.They will be coming here week after next to Martinsville.I'm glad I have to work that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest smoke.14 Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Well put Chrud! Three to go and teammates are behind a guy that would have possibly no help if they pulled out and if he got help it would have been too late. Coming out of turn four the preferred line is to hug the bottom and protect the bottom all the way. Talledega is one of the widest tracks in Nascar right??? Instead of teammates jumping to the outside to try and make a run on the 20, a ROOKIE driver that apparently likes to get teary eyed in his interviews, attempts to stick his nose where the only way he can get it there is to drop below the yellow line. The teary eyed boy's car was below the yellow line before his car even got beside the 20's. The 01 car sponsored by Visine Tear Drops decided to go below the yellow line to pass because I'm pretty sure he was the one making the decision to turn left instead of right. Smoke is one of the best at drafting and understanding the draft. If the two cars behind him would have been the 24, 48, or the 88, ( in any order ) instead of two drivers that are driving for a near dead team, we wouldnt be talking about this because either Smoke would have won anyways or the Hendrick guys would have made a move that made sense and won them the race. Nothing that the 01 and the 15 done made any sense. Shows they do not know much about drafting nor much about each other as teammates. Feeling sorry for a guy who made a poor decision when he and his teammate had many other options is just nieve. The rules stated in the driver's meeting before the Talledega Race plainly stated that passing below the yellow line was ILLEGAL! Did Smoke block him??? YES... thats what you do to protect your position as the leader. Question is...Could the 01 Kleenex Tissue Chevy made a better decision to get around the 20??? Absolutely. There's no shame in being outsmarted by a USAC Triple Crown & two time Cup Champ! There is however, shame in getting tears in your eyes and letting the whole world know that you're unhappy with NASCAR's decision to show the 20 as the winner when YOU BROKE THE RULES..... Hey DEI needs some sponsors next year! I can think of a few for the 01! Poor game plan + great execution of a poor game plan = 18th place! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrud Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Exactly. Neither the 01 or 15 are in the points chase. Neither has ever won a Cup race. Why be happy with running 2nd and 3rd? You see it all the time at plate tracks where the 2nd place cars gets out of line to go to the outside, but no one goes with him. With a teammate behind you, you know he'll stick with you. There is no reason the 01 shouldn't have won that race. He was in the PERFECT position to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snapper Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 My opinion...01 won that race! He went high...the 20 car went high to block...the 01 went low and had his front end under Tony. Tony cam low (to block) and the 01 (ROOKIE) made a smart move under the yellow line so not to wreck a chase contender and/or the rest of the field. He was forced down there and made a smart choice...next time I think you'll see guys just wrecking the lead car and we can watch them shed a tear about it. If I were in the 01 car...when Tony came down...I would have turned right and watched him spin in the grass! Either way...don't really care! However, I think Nascar blew it by not at least giving the 01 2nd place. Its not like he had time to get back in line and not advance his position...last lap, last turn. These restrictor plate races and yellow line crap just stinks. They should do away with the yellow line and cut the pavement off right there...back fill with gravel! That will stop them from going down there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 smoke.14 said: Well put Chrud! Three to go and teammates are behind a guy that would have possibly no help if they pulled out and if he got help it would have been too late. Coming out of turn four the preferred line is to hug the bottom and protect the bottom all the way. Talledega is one of the widest tracks in Nascar right??? Instead of teammates jumping to the outside to try and make a run on the 20, a ROOKIE driver that apparently likes to get teary eyed in his interviews, attempts to stick his nose where the only way he can get it there is to drop below the yellow line. The teary eyed boy's car was below the yellow line before his car even got beside the 20's. The 01 car sponsored by Visine Tear Drops decided to go below the yellow line to pass because I'm pretty sure he was the one making the decision to turn left instead of right. Smoke is one of the best at drafting and understanding the draft. If the two cars behind him would have been the 24, 48, or the 88, ( in any order ) instead of two drivers that are driving for a near dead team, we wouldnt be talking about this because either Smoke would have won anyways or the Hendrick guys would have made a move that made sense and won them the race. Nothing that the 01 and the 15 done made any sense. Shows they do not know much about drafting nor much about each other as teammates. Feeling sorry for a guy who made a poor decision when he and his teammate had many other options is just nieve. The rules stated in the driver's meeting before the Talledega Race plainly stated that passing below the yellow line was ILLEGAL! Did Smoke block him??? YES... thats what you do to protect your position as the leader. Question is...Could the 01 Kleenex Tissue Chevy made a better decision to get around the 20??? Absolutely. There's no shame in being outsmarted by a USAC Triple Crown & two time Cup Champ! There is however, shame in getting tears in your eyes and letting the whole world know that you're unhappy with NASCAR's decision to show the 20 as the winner when YOU BROKE THE RULES..... Hey DEI needs some sponsors next year! I can think of a few for the 01! Poor game plan + great execution of a poor game plan = 18th place! The rules also state that if you block an advancing car below the yellow line you shall be blag flagged yourself ( Replays clearly show that the 01 had more than a fender on Tony when Tony decided to try and force the 01 down in hopes he would back off the throttle .. ) ... ;) So using your analogy why didn't smoldering smoke get blacked flagged and sent for a pit pass thru ... ??? ... :confused: And why is it people feel that the 01 made a bad decission to to use open race surface ?? .. :confused: How many times have we seen JJ leave Gordon hanging for the win ?? Teammates yeah right .. :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rad_112176 Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 I will have to agree with smoke.14 here. You can clearly see that Smith had his right side tires below the yellow line before he even got up to Tony. I keep hearing everyone saying that Tony forced Smith below the yellow line and that is totally false. Tony did put and keep his car on the bottom of the " LEGAL " part of the race track to hold off Smith's run. Is that forcing anyone below the line? NO. Smith forced himself below the line when he did not make the decision to go high or to back off the throttle. If he wants to make that decision to just drive up the rear end of Tony and wreck him, like a few others have said, well lets see what happens when those guys get to bristol and wonder why they are spun out of the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 rad_112176 said: I will have to agree with smoke.14 here. You can clearly see that Smith had his right side tires below the yellow line before he even got up to Tony. I keep hearing everyone saying that Tony forced Smith below the yellow line and that is totally false. Tony did put and keep his car on the bottom of the " LEGAL " part of the race track to hold off Smith's run. Is that forcing anyone below the line? NO. Smith forced himself below the line when he did not make the decision to go high or to back off the throttle. If he wants to make that decision to just drive up the rear end of Tony and wreck him, like a few others have said, well lets see what happens when those guys get to bristol and wonder why they are spun out of the way. Don't know what videos you've been watching or what interviews you heard or read, but Tonly himself even says he intentionally blocked / ran the 01 down the track ... :confused: You may want to read this interview, and this is just one of many ... http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081006/SPORTS09/810060326/1002/RSS02 Then tell us Tony / NASCAR did nothing wrong ... The NASCAR RULES say that if you intentionally block someone below the yellow line you will be BLACK FLAGGED ... work around that theroy .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rad_112176 Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 You are correct. He does say that he purposely blocked him coming out of the turn. I did not see anywhere in the column that it said that he " ran " Smith below the line. Talladega, like many tracks, is a track where if you are in the lead you don't have the run coming off the corner due to the air pushing on your car like the guy behind you using your vehicle cutting through the air. Your only choice is to block whoever is the driver trying to make a run on you with the bump draft of whoever might be behind him. The rule says nothing about when blocking someone if they go below the yellow line then you will be black flagged, it say if you force someone below the yellow line you will be black flagged. I say we take out the pavement from below the yellow line and see if he could make that pass in the grass. That area is there for the safety of the drivers and not as a racing surface. Tony had all the right to try and block for the lead and if Smith was not such a rookie he would have realized that he needed to make his pass at the top and that a experienced driver was not going to give up the bottom. As for what videos i have been wathching.... I was sitting in turn 2 and watched the whole thing happening. Here is a column that you might want to read. It pretty well sums up everything i have been saying since the " illegal " move was made. http://www.nascar.com/2008/news/opinion/10/07/cross.words.talladega/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Funny that the only one that agree's with nascar is a colomnist that writes for Nascar.com and Stewart fans .. :rolleyes: So I guess all of those thousands that watched the race and emailed in and voiced their displeasure and every other sports writer ... is WRONG and of course NASCAR is right ... :rolleyes: I sure wish it had been JJ in second at the time ,, Stewart would have been wrecked and then all of the Stewart fans would be head hunting calling him a cheater and unsportsman like .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rad_112176 Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Jr fan here. I like Tony, but rules are rules. I guess i haven't seen an article that didn't say he wasn't below the yellow line before he got there. Everyone knows the pass was illegal, but they are going off the rule that they thought it was ok on the last lap. Now i do agree that there was a NASCAR worker that did say it on past show about a truck race and that is where most of the confusion has come from. I guess we will just need to disagree on this one. LOL. I am not saying i agree with NASCAR on most of there choices. I just think they got this one right. Now if you put a big name in second and Smith in first and i will not say that NASCAR will not make a different decision. I am sure if Jr was in second i would have a total different opinion on this. LOL. JK. I also think that if Tony was trying to block Smith and he would have gotten spun then he deserved it. That is a chance you take when trying to block someone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 We're OK rad ... :D I'm a Gordon fan so it's fun to have a little fun at someone elses expense for a change .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rad_112176 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 LOL. I hear ya there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest smoke.14 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 Thank You Chrud and Rad 112176! I can understand why the 01 was so upset because that's the closest he's ever been to winning a race and I understand why so many are taking the "underdog's" side of this cause many like to see a new winner every now and then and that's okay. However, Mike Helton made the right call. If you notice, this is nearly a dead subject now on most media outlets. I'm sure thats due to the high profile driver winning Dega and a low profile driver getting penalized for a rule violation. The media coverage may have been different if this deal involved two big names at the end, but regardless of the cast, the call was accurate and most of all... Official! Smoke usually wins in pairs so..... let's go to Charlotte!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rad_112176 Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 I will say one thing. If you are going to pay the money to go see a race and you only have one to choose from, Dega is the one i would choose (So Far). We are planning on going to Bristol next year. Anyone ever been? Seat Suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randyman Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 rad_112176 said: We are planning on going to Bristol next year. Anyone ever been? Seat Suggestions? I've been and your going to love it! You'll quickly learn why they call it Thunder Valley! As far as seats go, they are hard enough to get that you should be thankful for ANY seat at Bristol! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrud Posted October 10, 2008 Report Share Posted October 10, 2008 rad_112176 said: If you are going to pay the money to go see a race and you only have one to choose from, Dega is the one i would choose Not me. I've never been to Talladega and never will. Personally, I would never pay money to "watch" a race on anything over 3/4 mile. I'm not going to spend all that money for tickets and a trip to hear cars rumbling in the distance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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