kempronnie Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 MT Highway Patrol Officer David Moon and MT Fish Wildlife, and Parks Warden MikeHerman Responsible for killing a small fawn My father Ron Kemp, Freedom Crawford, and Dan McKee were doing a search on about the 500 block of Fairweather Street in Wolf Point, Montana. After they were done, Dan's drug dog had to go to the bathroom. Dan let her go in the weeds. The dog discovered a baby whitetail fawn. The men looked at it and came to the conclusion the mother had abandon it. So doing what they thought was right, they decided to give the little guy a chance at life. The baby was so dehydrated we did not know if it would make it one more day. So, Freedom being a tribal member of the Fort Peck Indian Reservation said he would take the fawn. He asked my dad if we would take care of it until he got his yard fenced so no dog could harm the baby. My dad told him yes. I was put in charge of caring for the little guy. Which I took very seriously. The little guy was doing very and started to but weight back on. He also was running and playing with my dog. My dog also started to take part in the caring of the little fawn. He would clean him and watch over him out in our yard. To me it was a lot like having a baby human. Feeding him every two hours and making sure he was able to go to the bathroom. Let me tell you, this also means I was only getting around four to five hours of sleep a night. See, a new born whitetail fawns don't have the body function to go to the bathroom on their own until there older. You have to stimulate their colon and their bladder. Then the day comes he is killed. I had to go help my grandmother at the farm which is about 50 miles from where I live. I took off and was headed that way. I was pulled over by Montana Highway Patrolmen David Moon for speeding. He came up to my pick-up and told me I was pulled over for exceeding the speed limit. He then asked for all my paper work. I gave it to him. Then he asked if that was a baby deer I told him yes. If I would of know that David Moon was as cold hearted as he is, I would not of answered him. He didn't say anything more about it. He went back to his car and wrote me a speeding ticket. Officer Moon then came back and gave me my ticket and paper work. I thought we were done so I told him have a good day. He told me no, you have to wait for the Game Warden. I said, "You called the Game Warden?" "Yes", he said. I said to him it's going to be a Tribal Game Warden right. He said no, a State Game Warden. I asked him why a State Game Warden was coming when we were still on the reservation. He did not answer me. I then told him that the baby fawns was not mine, that I was just watching it for Sheriff Freedom Crawford, that must of went in one ear and out the other. Then State Game Warden Mike Herman showed up and took the little guy and killed it. These heartless men didn't even try to verify my story. They just thought they stop some dumb white kid with a deer. They killed this baby fawn as soon as they could. I felt they should of at the least checked with Sheriff Freedom Crawford. They did not even take the time to make one phone call or use the vehicle radios to contact Sheriff Crawford to see if I was telling the truth or not. That's all they had to do. It would of saved this little fawns life. I told Officer Moon I didn't have Freedom's cell number or I would call him, but I'm sure you guys know how to get a hold of him. Not only did these heartless men not do their jobs, they also failed to follow the Tribal law. I hope the Tribes do everything in their power to prosecute these two. If this fawn was mine, I could understand it based on the fact that I am governed under state law. It was not mine, it was three little girl's pet. These two man did not even think about how these three little ones would feel when their dad had to tell them their pet was killed because these two law providers do not know how to do their jobs. If these are the kind of heartless people we have protecting our highways and the wild game around here, I think we should take a closer look at those we put in charge. It was not necessary for them to kill the baby before checking out the whole story. From their behavior, it is obvious that they did not care about the truth. They seemed more concerned in killing this baby fawn then founding out if I was telling the truth. That's how I feel about it. Now you know the story about how the Montana Highway Patrol Officer David Moon and Department of Montana Fish, Wildlife, and Parks Warden Mike Herman are both responsible in the killing of a baby fawn that belonged to three little girl's from the Fort Peck Indian Reservation. Thanks for taking time to reading. Feel free to state your thoughtsRonnie Kemp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Too bad for the fawn.....FYI it is illegal to possess a wild animal without a permit. Thats a federal law......even indian tribes are not above it. I'll be perfectly honest with you on the tribal law thing. I think it's a bunch of BS. You live in America, and you should be governed by American Law! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Personally I don't think it is right for you to go on the internet and bash two LEO's when they cannot defend themselves or tell their side of the story. For all we know you could be lying. Why don't you withdraw this thread. :ban: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWSmith Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 RangerClay said: Personally I don't think it is right for you to go on the internet and bash two LEO's when they cannot defend themselves or tell their side of the story. For all we know you could be lying. Why don't you withdraw this thread. :ban: A suspicious first posting to say the least...:shifty: You definitely came to the wrong place if all you joined for was to bash LEO's. You may get a better response if you posted your rant on a tree huggers site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dakota Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 The_Kat said: I'll be perfectly honest with you on the tribal law thing. I think it's a bunch of BS. You live in America, and you should be governed by American Law! I see where you are coming from, Kyle, but I don't agree with you. Indian tribes should be able to govern themselves, after all it was we who took everything away from them. I say this as an American and as one of mostly (the most of any other ethnic group in my background, my great-grandmother was a full blooded Indian) Cherokee descent. RangerClay said: Personally I don't think it is right for you to go on the internet and bash two LEO's when they cannot defend themselves or tell their side of the story. For all we know you could be lying. Why don't you withdraw this thread. :ban: Well said, Joe! Dakota Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 GWSmith said: A suspicious first posting to say the least...:shifty: You definitely came to the wrong place if all you joined for was to bash LEO's. You may get a better response if you posted your rant on a tree huggers site. Maybe he is a Nike shoe spammer trying to distract us! :shifty: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c_lou Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Somebody call Swampy. Theres about be a public hanging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NS whitetail Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 c_lou said: Somebody call Swampy. Theres about be a public hanging. baaahaaaaaaaaa ......... that was my thoughts at first :gun_bandana::2guns::gun_bandana::2guns: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Dakota said: I see where you are coming from, Kyle, but I don't agree with you. Indian tribes should be able to govern themselves, after all it was we who took everything away from them. I say this as an American and as one of mostly (the most of any other ethnic group in my background, my great-grandmother was a full blooded Indian) Cherokee descent. Well said, Joe! Dakota I'm 1/4 cherokee, my moms half. I still don't think indians should be above the FED and STATE laws....on the reservation or anywhere. It's bad enough they can put build casinos, let alone whine about being forced to obey American law....gonna have to agree to disagree here Dakota, this is one issue I get heated over somewhat quickly as I deal with it in Oklahoma constantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamphunter Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 (edited) First off, I am in NO WAY supporting killing a healthy fawn for no reason with the following statements, but I have to chime in... Im here.. have been staying out of this one though. This sounds very suspicious and has me riled already. I think this 1st time posters thread should just be viewed as spam and deleted. There is no proof, supporting articles or anything that I could pull up from web searches to support such allegations that not just 1 officer, but 2 officers had done something inappropriate or illegal. I am very close to picking this thread apart, breaking it down sentence by sentence and applying common sense thinking, application of Vehicle and traffic law, search and seizure laws, and the enviromental laws and showing where this kid is just a wee bit off the mark. At least as he has posted here... Excuse me, but I am just going to step aside now and prevent myself from getting banned. Edited June 22, 2009 by Swamphunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 lets see if they come back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutchies Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 I can understand different laws on the reservation. I can't however understand the right for them to build casinos and conduct legal gambling. If the indians can do it then so should everyone else. As for whether or not this thread is true.............I really hope it is all false because I don't agree with what the officers did at all. There's a difference between hunting and killing. If they shot the fawn it was killing and these are the kind of cases PETA searches for daily to make hunters look like idiots. Hopefully the guy will come back and post some more. I wouldn't mind seeing the officers post as well. Not all but you guys have to admit that there are guys that shouldn't be LEO's that are. We have a local Cheif of Police that has been caught several times on the Chickasaw Childrens home land hunting and when asked why he was in there said he is Chickasaw and thought anybody with a CDIB card could hunt in there. He was issued no citations. Only given a warning BOTH times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdhunter39 Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 what about the first amendment freedom of speech ??? i understand that he's also talking about tribal laws ( which i know nothing about ) but bashing a kid his first time in in really isn't nice . i also know that keeping wild animals is illegal without proper paper work . I've talked to this person in the chatroom and he seems cool. almost all that I've heard so far is spammer , banning etc. when did GOD give you the authority on passing judgment . I understand we want a happy place to come to ( REALTREE ) and we want to keep those kind of people out , i say in my own opinion , i'll give him and anyone else a chance , welcome to realtree kemp . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 birdhunter39 said: what about the first amendment freedom of speech ??? Freedom of speech doesn't apply in a private forum bud. But I agree with your point, thus me saying lets see if he comes back.:disolve: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIwhitetailhunter Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 How about locking this thread before it gets out of control with the whole tribal can and can not do if it's not going to be withdrawn or deleted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NS whitetail Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 by the way............. welcome to the forums kemp, come back and introduce yourself :cowboy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawg Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 How was this a pet? As stated in previous posts, you can't legally own a wild animal without proper paperwork. I feel sorry that the fawn was supposedly killed. How can a HP inforce law on a reservation if a GW can't? You asked if it was a tribal GW. Was the HP a tribal HP (not that there is such)? Of course I could be wrong but I didn't think HP could patrol reservations. You also said you are white, not indian, therefore you aren't covered by tribal law while on a reservation. I don't see how the Tribe of said reservation can prosecute State officers. Just my two pennies worth............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Quote Quote: Originally Posted by The_Kat I'll be perfectly honest with you on the tribal law thing. I think it's a bunch of BS. You live in America, and you should be governed by American Law! I see where you are coming from, Kyle, but I don't agree with you. Indian tribes should be able to govern themselves, after all it was we who took everything away from them. I say this as an American and as one of mostly (the most of any other ethnic group in my background, my great-grandmother was a full blooded Indian) Cherokee descent. I agree with Dakota here. You may wish that tribal laws and treaties are/were different than they are but hey..wake up, they are what they are, so live with it guys. It's not Kemp's fault. I think a few of you are over reacting here IMHO.:poke: Lets assume the story is true, OK,:disolve: and if it is, then I think it was a senseless killing of a fawn on one hand. But .. having the fawn with you on the highway and speeding was the biggest mistake you made Kemp. Not only did you draw attention to yourself by speeding, but you drew attention to the fawn also, since you were transporting a live wild critter. It is too bad they didn't verify your story, and just let it go, but they were following the laws too. I feel bad for the fawn being put down like that after all the personal care you had invested in it's life and I feel sorry for you getting bashed like you are by other members.:poke: On the other hand, I too would like to hear the other side. If indeed you were still on the reserve Kemp, then why was it being patrolled by a state trooper? Something doesn't sound right there, but maybe you can explain. Welcome to the forums Kemp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kempronnie Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 well on the rez i live on the hp is crossed deputized. so he can enforce the laws of the highway. they however don't have the authority to enforce game laws. that's way the rez has tribal game wardens. state game wardens are not crossed deputized. so they have no jurisdiction on the reservation. a white guy can not hunt any big game on the rez. so if i was hunting on the rez for whitetail and shoot one. then got stopped for seeding by an hp they have to call a tribal game Warden because i do fall under the tribal game law even as a white guy cause i would of been caught on the rez. i have lived here for 16 years and still are learning all the laws between state and tribal law. the guy that owned the deer is the sheriff. he told me after i asked if we were done and the hp said yes. but i had to Waite for the state game Warden i should of told him no you Waite for him and drove way. i think if i was in the wrong here the tribal executive Bord would not be looking at prosecuting these two for the fun of it. a state game Warden can't come on to the rez. and take a rez. deer off it and kill it or kill it on the rez. no matter what. even if a tribal game Warden tells them they can. they still can't do it with out the permission of the tribal executive Bord. they have to voting on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kempronnie Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 yeah well i'm sure they thought it was bs back in the day when we took everything from them. so live with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawg Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Glad to see you came back and added more. Here is what I don't understand, how can you expect the Sheriff to say he owns a wild animal without the proper papers? Just because he found it doesn't mean it was his for the keeping. That would put his reputation on the line. Bottom line is he owned that deer as much as I did and there wasn't anything I can see that he could have done to help. Yea, it was wrong for them to put it down, but a GW has the right to make that decision. Now on the tribal law vs. state law, I'm clueless as I'm 100% whiteboy, but I don't see how a tribe can inforce their law onto state officers. Yea it is a reservation, but that reservation is part of the United States of America. Again just my two pennies........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kempronnie Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 i only speak the truth. there will be an artical in the wolf point journal this week about it. also my father has been in lawenforcement for about 28 years. if you don't beleave there are people like this in lawenforcment then you need to wake up and smell something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kempronnie Posted June 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 (edited) see he is a tribale member and this is his land so everything on it belongs to the tribes and there tribale members as far as game animals go. so yeah he does have a lot more ownership over it then you. Edited June 22, 2009 by kempronnie forgot to put something more in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawg Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Is the 500 block of Fairweather Street in Wolf Point, Montana on the reservation? This is where the fawn was found, correct? If this isn't on the reservation and this is where the fawn was found, how can the tribe lay claim to it? Just trying to understand the flip side here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texastrophies Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 None of this wouldn't have been an issue if they wouldn't have taken a wild animal in the first place. Deer habitually hide their young and then come back to them. I doubt very seriously if it was abandoned. And if it was, so be it, that is the natural sequence of events. You, your father, and the rest of the people involved were wrong for taking that fawn. With that being said, I think you need to tone down your responses some, and start participating in the rest of the forum and you will be a welcome member. But as it is your only post are publicly slamming 2 LEO and doesn't really make that good of a first impression here, regardless of if you are right or wrong. Carry on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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