RangerClay Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I flew this in AT and didn't get much help so I decided to check here with my friends. Maybe I can fix this thing myself with your help. Please bear with me if I don't get the exact terminology correct. I really want this fixed before my trip in September. Three years ago when I got into archery I bought a new bow with a Whisker Biscuit rest and an Extreme RT 900 sight. The guy I bought it from is the only pro shop owner around. I was fairly happy with my set-up since I was a newbie but I wanted a change when I got more experienced. So recently I bought a QAD Ultra Rest HD. When I picked it up the bow the pro told me to shoot it and see how I liked it. Immediately it did not feel right. Normally I would look through my peep and line-up the orange ring of my sight inside the circle of my peep, get things level, put the pin on the target and release. When I drew back, 1/3rd of my sight ring was behind the riser. I could still see the target but it really didn't give me much of a sight picture. So I asked the pro about it. He said I would have to live with it because it is paper tuned. I told him about the sight picture. I a huff, he took the bow into the shop, loosened some screws and moved the sight over a couple taps. "Here try this. You will be able to see a little more but your bow is not tuned now." Now 1/4 of the ring is behind the riser. To say the least I was furious and I let the guy know it. I wanted it fixed, not out of tune. Since then I have been quietly thinking about my options and doing some summer chores that were more important. But as I said my trip is just around the corner and it is practice time. So what do you think friends? Is this something I can fix myself or should I free up an hours drive to the next closest pro shop? Your thoughts please... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layin on the smackdown Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 Man, thats a tough one...Its too bad you don't have another local shop to go to to get a second opinion. It sounds like when this guy was tuning your bow, he may have tweaked something that didn't need tweaking. I have never seen a sight that has any part of the ring sitting behind the riser. That seems awefully funny to me. Its hard to say without seeing it, but then again, i don't have a civil engineering degree either. Can you post some pics of everything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I'm NO expert by any means, but it sure sounds as if the rest isn't installed square to the string ... Not too sure this guy even paper tuned this bow, especially if the sight window is out of alignment .. But I'm 100% sure he shouldn't have treated you the way he did ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camoman1 Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 Im kind of dealing with the same problem with the GF's bow. She is shooting an old Golden Eagle and I noticed that half the site window was behind the riser when I looked through it. I squared up the rest with the string (so I thought) and it still shot so far right that the sight needed to be that far over......hopefully one of our more bow savvy friends can answer this one:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2008 Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I would set it right for ya for free if the distance wasn't an issue. I don't know how he can say moving the sight over is going to make the bow out of tune. It would just make it not sighted in. I would definately go to another shop and have them set it up for you. Make sure they check the cam so that everything is on time. A mathews dealer should be able too do that for you. After that have them re set up your rest. On some of the older bows your sight has to be covered up by the riser. It is just the way the bow is built. On your mission bow though it shouldn't have to be that far over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan Givan Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I would set it right for ya for free if the distance wasn't an issue. I don't know how he can say moving the sight over is going to make the bow out of tune. It would just make it not sighted in. I would definately go to another shop and have them set it up for you. Make sure they check the cam so that everything is on time. A mathews dealer should be able too do that for you. After that have them re set up your rest. On some of the older bows your sight has to be covered up by the riser. It is just the way the bow is built. On your mission bow though it shouldn't have to be that far over. Yep. Moving the sight has nothing to do with the bow being in tune. that arrow will shoot just as straight no matter where the sight is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 (edited) Here's my home-made Center-shot tool. Try to get the hole in the wood straight...eh Just pretend the rubber piece is the laser beam. Set it to the string first, while resting it just below where your rest screws on to your bow. Once the rubber is set to mid string, flip the whole thing over, and adjust your REST (without moving the rubber) until the rubber is in the center of your arrow. rubber thingy (Tuffy Button): http://www.keystonecountrystore.com/Archery_Equipment_-_Supplies/Strings_-_String_Accessories/String_Accessories/AMG_Tuffy_Button_5_pack/Page_1/STA1235502.html Here's a link to the Laser Centershot tool, just to give you an idea... http://www.mountain-archery.com/index.asp?PageAction=Custom&ID=46 I hope I explained it OK. If not, I'll take some pictures of me using it. Edited August 15, 2009 by buckee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I'm NO expert by any means, but it sure sounds as if the rest isn't installed square to the string ... Not too sure this guy even paper tuned this bow, especially if the sight window is out of alignment .. But I'm 100% sure he shouldn't have treated you the way he did ... Got to agree with Luke here. Have usually gotten pretty darned close lining up looking in a mirrror with the bow drawn with an arrow knocked Joe. You can kind of see if the string and rest are properly lined up while looking down your arrow. I could be wrong, but would think that the sight should be irrelevant to paper tuning. The arrow flight(tuning) is not going to change with sight changes, but will with rest or nock point changes. The poi is what will change with your sight changes. If this bowshop guy was adamant about this, I would no longer use him. Think I would get a large piece of paper and shoot through the paper myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted August 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I would set it right for ya for free if the distance wasn't an issue. A mathews dealer should be able too do that for you. After that have them re set up your rest. On some of the older bows your sight has to be covered up by the riser. It is just the way the bow is built. On your mission bow though it shouldn't have to be that far over. Thanks Tom! And thank you everyone else. The guy who did this was the only Mathews dealer around so I will have to drive another hour to the next one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 That little tool I made will put your arrow rest in the right spot. Thenm just move your sights over accordingly and sight in again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 Joe, the shop doesn't have to be a Mathews dealer to set your rest up properly ... I can't believe the treatment this guy gave you ... is he the shop owner ?? ,, if he's not, I'd be talkin' to the owner .. Just might be me, but when I pay for a service, I want it to be right as possible, without the grief or gruff .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 I'd be talkin' to the owner .. Just might be me, but when I pay for a service, I want it to be right as possible, without the grief or gruff .. Again with Luke. Consumers should be able to get service without being given grief, customer service sells. Some shops or people working for them out there seem to care less about their customers. I prefer if at all possible not to do business with folks who do not appreciate me as a customer. I like Steve's center shot tool there too, got an idea how it works but would be interested in seeing pics of it in use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okiedog Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 Here is my input on how I set bows up... for what little it is worth..lol. Install your rest first, getting it as close to recommend center shot as possible. Then I put on the loop (or nock) at 1/16"-1/8" high off of level. Then I paper tune, fine tuning the rest till I get the clean hole I want. Then I install the peep. I put the peep in close then draw the bow back with eyes closed till I'am at full draw then open my eyes and see the the peep is at the right height. I do all of this before the sight is put on. I have seen to many people try to bob their head trying to be able to see the pins. After I am happy with all of that will I install the sights. I get the sights close left and right by looking down the string and centering my rest in it then putting the pins in the center of the string. After all of that is when it is time to sight in the pins. I have seen some bows depending on the sight window, ATA, size of pin guard, etc that the whole pin guard was not visiable because of the riser. The important thing to make sure first is that the arrow is flying true/square to the bow. Also you need to be the one paper tuning your bow. Everyones grip is different and that will make a slight difference in the flight of the arrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tedicast Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 RangerClay...what model Mathews is the bow you are shooting??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom2008 Posted August 15, 2009 Report Share Posted August 15, 2009 RangerClay...what model Mathews is the bow you are shooting??? Mission X3 I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted August 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Mission X3 I think. Yep! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig mack Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Your sight has nothing to do with your bow being in tune or not. Go to another shop and have them check your center shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerClay Posted August 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Joe, the shop doesn't have to be a Mathews dealer to set your rest up properly ... I can't believe the treatment this guy gave you ... is he the shop owner ?? ,, if he's not, I'd be talkin' to the owner .. Just might be me, but when I pay for a service, I want it to be right as possible, without the grief or gruff .. Yes Luke, this guy is the owner. His problem is that he extremely arrogant and I had plenty of people tell me this before I even bought the bow. But I wanted to be fair and give the guy a chance. You know, never judge a book by it's cover. Well he blew his chance. And actually this was his second chance. So I am done with him and his cheatin/money grubbing ways. Most of you know where I live. I would stay away from this Mathews dealer. Now I have a Hoyt dealer just over the Tug about 40 minutes away. I may go visit him and see what he thinks. I'm thinking about switching to his winter league. It may a good way to introduce myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWSmith Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Go somewhere else for sure!!! Centershot, String Loop(nock point), then Sights;) Your idea of checking out the Hoyt dealer and possibly making friends with someone you can trust...Excellent! BTW...Steves centershot tool works everytime since it works off the distance from the riser;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michiganbowhunter_SQ2 Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Find the specs for your bow and check ATA, brace height, and idler lean. If your Idler lean is off , it will effect the centershot a bit. After all that is set walkback tune to get your centershot. I'm guessing this guy just threw the rest on, adjusted the sight, and called it "tuned" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Now I have a Hoyt dealer just over the Tug about 40 minutes away. I may go visit him and see what he thinks. I'm thinking about switching to his winter league. It may a good way to introduce myself. And I'm sure he would welcome your business Joe .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Hey guy's check out this video, it might help explain a few things more clearly .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Hey guy's check out this video, it might help explain a few things more clearly .. Awesome video Luke. That tool I made works and looks a lot like that one he is using. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig mack Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 Cool video Luke!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michiganbowhunter_SQ2 Posted August 16, 2009 Report Share Posted August 16, 2009 (edited) Those centershot tools like buckee made are nice. But they do not always give you the correct centershot. On Mathews, and I am pretty sure Mission bows (might be for all single cam bows), the idler lean effects where the centershot is. Where it is at rest, is not where centershot is at full draw. Same thing with those laser centershot tools. They can give you a good starting point though and they DO work with other bows. Edited August 16, 2009 by Michiganbowhunter_SQ2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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