The_Kat Posted January 13, 2010 Report Share Posted January 13, 2010 So this is gonna be long....but if your in college you should read this carefully. It could happen to you. I get a phone call this morning around 10:30 from Jennifer crying. She is freaking out because the college is telling her she didn't take a class she was supposed to and now is not going to get her teaching degree until she takes the class. She can graduate and get a degree, but it won't be a teaching degree til she passes the class. Jennifer got her graduation check for her teaching license yesterday and was told she was a green light for her license and graduation. It wasn't until this morning that her and 4 other girls were held after class to be told they missed a class and weren't graduating. Most teaching degrees take 4 years....this will be Jennifer's 5th year. She has taken no less than 14 hours a semester as well as 16-17 hours a few semesters. Theres no reason she shouldnt have graduated last May, but SOSU's is ridiculous with their teaching program that it takes 5 years for 80% of their students. Ok...back to the story. Every semester a freeze is placed on a students file until the meet with their academic advisor. In other words they can't enroll in classes without speaking to a professor in their degree field who places them in their classes to ensure they get whats required to graduate. Jenn has been at SOSU for 3 years so that means she has had 6 grad checks. The class they said she was missing was from her associates degree at Eastern. So it took them 6 semesters to figure out she was short a class. Thats the point where I got the phone call with her in tears....I was not very pleased to put it nicely. I get dressed and head to the school. Once I arrive I see the line of girls....ALL very upset....waiting on their fate from their advisors. Luckily for Jennifer they found that she had taken a sociology class in place of the history class in question and she was granted her graduate license as well as her teaching license based on completion of her student teaching which is in progress. The bad part.....Jennifer is the only one who was so lucky. The other girls are being forced to take the class that was missed NEXT semester as it isn't available now. This is going to force them to wait an ENTIRE year on a job, as well as delayed their graduation date til next December and will put them at 5.5 years for a job that pays 30k a year. The girls only did what was asked of them, and that was to attend class, pass the class, and be at class. It's the professors that dropped the ball, so the university is the one at fault. This is a very big deal....your messing with peoples money, their jobs, their family lives, and their heads with all this stress that is unwarranted! One of the girls is my good friend Jennifer B. She took a semester off last semester for her baby girl to be born because she was told alls she had left was student teaching this semester. Now she is being forced to take a class this summer, or fall, and will miss out on this next school years hiring dates. It's bullcrap and something needs to be done. I told the dean of the education department that this was a situation that could have been avoided and that I thought they should do whatever possible to make it right. If Jenn hadn't been lucky enough to be cleared we would have been seeking legal counsel. Depending on what happens with these girls ( 4 now....that is about 20% of this years class ) I am thinking of contacting radio stations, the local news, and starting a petition in the city. Fair is fair and this is not fair! To you college students....stay on top of your academic affairs. Don't trust your advisors!:bang: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doe-ee Posted January 13, 2010 Report Share Posted January 13, 2010 Wow. That's so unfair. Are they all missing the same class? If so, you would think it would be in everyone's (including the school's) best interest to provide that class before the end of this term. Something needs to be shaken up there alright...... besides the students! Good warning advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted January 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2010 Are they all missing the same class? No, but ironically 3 of the 4 left in jeopardy all have the same advisor....who just happens to be the head of the education department. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
007hunter Posted January 13, 2010 Report Share Posted January 13, 2010 Unfortunately, I've heard this situation way to often and it is sad... Glad it worked out though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkeygirl Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 Wow...I cannot imagine...I'm glad it worked out for Jennifer. I know I always kept an eye to make sure what I needed class wise was done as I'd heard stories of people having to stay an extra semester for a missed class,etc.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkoholic Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 My one comment, which you will not like, is that every student is responsible for themselves and it is up to the individual to know the required classes for the degree they are seeking. My college journey started at the ripe age of 37 and I had by that time learned that it is best to take care of yourself and be aware of the tasks you need to complete. Do not trust advisers to take care of you. I saw many cases of this while in college, as has anyone who has taken that route. The transition from one school to another is seldom smooth. One of life's lessons learned. Time to move on, and a little wiser for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevebeilgard Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 it actually happens all the time, in most states. these colleges are in it for the money. i'm glad jen is going to graduate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted January 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 My one comment, which you will not like, is that every student is responsible for themselves and it is up to the individual to know the required classes for the degree they are seeking. My college journey started at the ripe age of 37 and I had by that time learned that it is best to take care of yourself and be aware of the tasks you need to complete. Do not trust advisers to take care of you. I saw many cases of this while in college, as has anyone who has taken that route. The transition from one school to another is seldom smooth. One of life's lessons learned. Time to move on, and a little wiser for it. When your told you can substitue one class for another and then find out it was a mistake whose to blame? This is not a case of student laziness or lack of attention to detail...so please don't preach that here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 The girls only did what was asked of them, and that was to attend class, pass the class, and be at class. It's the professors that dropped the ball, so the university is the one at fault. I consider you a good friend, and I know you to be a straight shooter, and you know I'm a straight shooter when it comes to my good friends, so I don't mind telling you, I think you're wrong about what I bolded up above, and I say that with all due respect, and having no knowledge of how universities run in Oklahoma. Ultimately, it's the student's degree, and they are responsible for their degree and keeping track of their classes. When I was in undergrad they gave us all the classes we needed (in written form) and we checked them off as we went along. Does this university not print off degree requirements? I couldn't imagine starting a program not knowing what was required of me. I would think that's a breach of contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted January 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 I consider you a good friend, and I know you to be a straight shooter, and you know I'm a straight shooter when it comes to my good friends, so I don't mind telling you, I think you're wrong about what I bolded up above, and I say that with all due respect, and having no knowledge of how universities run in Oklahoma. Ultimately, it's the student's degree, and they are responsible for their degree and keeping track of their classes. When I was in undergrad they gave us all the classes we needed (in written form) and we checked them off as we went along. Does this university not print off degree requirements? I couldn't imagine starting a program not knowing what was required of me. I would think that's a breach of contract. No offense taken Chris....however you are mistaken. The college does print off grad checklists but the proffesors are the ones who enroll you and keep your official checklist. You can't enroll yourself, the professor must enroll you. So it is the responsibilty of the professor to ensure the student graduates and takes the classes they need to graduate. The professors are the one who signs the grad checks to get into your professional field of study....you have to apply to get in. You can't just take a class because you want here. I imagine some things have changed since you were in college perhaps....maybe not, I'm not sure. Also the students with the issues are all from other colleges with elementary education associates degrees. They are redflagging a 2000 level course here. So if the college was not going to accept the gen. ed check then they should have caught it immediately when they began college at SOSU. I honestly have a feeling this will be handled the way it should be by tomorrow. We got a phone call from Jennifer B. and the dean contacted her to setup a meeting in the morning. He assured her this would be made right....I'll keep ya all updated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWSmith Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 (edited) To you college students....stay on top of your academic affairs. Don't trust your advisors!:bang: There is the answer...as simple as it seems. Personal responsibility is the key to getting what is needed. When I went to College I was given a list of the things I needed to graduate with my degree. The entire time I was there I not only knew what I needed I had it on paper plain enough that even I could understand it. I paid tuition for the services they provided for me(what they taught in classes)...everything else was my responsibility to make sure it was in place when graduation came around. At no time was it the colleges responsibility if I dropped the ball....after all I was the one carrying it. Edited January 14, 2010 by GWSmith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swohiodave Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 It is sad, i was all set to graduate and went to meet with my advisor and she said i still had a class to take. i told her to took exactly what she told me i needed to graduate and she said i was wrong. I pulled out a piece of scratch paper she ripped off of another paper with all of my classes on it from when i started. she read that and looked at me and said "i guess your finished then, that is my handwriting!" Great! Then when i go back for my bachelors they tried to get me to push a class back a semester instead of taking 15 credits and they knew i would have had to take more than that 1 class because i was full time for financial aid. You have to really keep your guard up and that is sad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkoholic Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 When your told you can substitue one class for another and then find out it was a mistake whose to blame? This is not a case of student laziness or lack of attention to detail...so please don't preach that here. As I stated, you would not like my comment and you will not like this one either. If it was not documented, it never happened. It should be in writing which class substitutes for another. I agree that this should have been caught earlier and transfer students have to be aware of a school accepting classes taken somewhere else. Once again, if it is not documented, it never happened. I am not trying to preach. I am talking from experience. I stand by my earlier post, do not trust someone else to take care of you. The student has the ultimate responsibility of ensuring they attain the necessary classes. If indeed the Oklahoma university system is placing each student in the hands of a professor who, basically, babysits that student through to graduation then they certainly are not preparing that student for the real world. Before you get your dander up any more I will end with this; I am glad it worked out for your girlfriend and hopefully the rest of the students can finish their degree on time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairiepredator Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 At least it all worked out for Jen. That must be a horrible situation for the other girls though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted January 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 As I stated, you would not like my comment and you will not like this one either. If it was not documented, it never happened. It should be in writing which class substitutes for another. I agree that this should have been caught earlier and transfer students have to be aware of a school accepting classes taken somewhere else. Once again, if it is not documented, it never happened. I am not trying to preach. I am talking from experience. I stand by my earlier post, do not trust someone else to take care of you. The student has the ultimate responsibility of ensuring they attain the necessary classes. If indeed the Oklahoma university system is placing each student in the hands of a professor who, basically, babysits that student through to graduation then they certainly are not preparing that student for the real world. Before you get your dander up any more I will end with this; I am glad it worked out for your girlfriend and hopefully the rest of the students can finish their degree on time. It's in writing on the General ed checklist....also the sub was made in writing too. Thats how Jenn got cleared. One thing...how in the heck is placing a student on a graduate track not preparing them for the real world? College is the real world....once your outta high school, your in the real world. Most of the folks in here disagreeing with the facts are college graduates from some time back....things have changed as this isn't just a practice in Oklahoma....it's all over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubledrop Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 just glad it worked out Kyle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 The college does print off grad checklists but the proffesors are the ones who enroll you and keep your official checklist. You can't enroll yourself, the professor must enroll you. So it is the responsibilty of the professor to ensure the student graduates and takes the classes they need to graduate Then that's a bad situation. Something as important as your degree put in somebody else's hands? Crazy. I can distinctly remember going over my courses with my advisor and deans constantly. I mapped my way through all the time, and as elk mentioned, I had stuff signed by advisors and deans all the time, and I kept them. Like somebody else mentioned, and what I realized while in college too, colleges are money grabbers. If they think they can get more money out of you, that's what they'll do. I remember having to repeat a class at UT because my associates listed the class as a Literature class whereas my associate's listed it as a writing class. Same exact book! Most of the folks in here disagreeing with the facts are college graduates from some time back....things have changed as this isn't just a practice in Oklahoma....it's all over. So now you're calling me old, what an AF. OK, so yes, my undergrad was in 1991, and things have changed, but I really think this is a situation with that university or that professor. My graduate program was 60 hours, 5 classes. The classes and their requirements were clearly expressed up front, in writing. My graduate degree was in 2006. So now what homeboy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeramie Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 it actually happens all the time, in most states. these colleges are in it for the money. i'm glad jen is going to graduate. Yup.... Yup! Thats exactly right. It all about the dollar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dartonman Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 I think they heard threw the grapevine you were CRAZY...and let her go on without the young ladies without a CRAZY GUY by their side....on a serious note, you are totally correct...we must all make sure when taking any classes, that you stay on top of them, not the advisor......al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texan_Til_I_Die Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 ...My graduate program was 60 hours, 5 classes...How the heck did you get 60 hours out of 5 classes? It took me something like 17 or 18 classes to get mine! And on the original subject - IF everything was documented IN WRITING and then after completion the university changed the rules, then they're certainly at fault. Moral of the story - Get everything in writing ahead of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerforged Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 Been there, done that! My oldest daughter went to a 2 year school to get all of the grunt classes out of the way and then transferred to a school for her major. We were assured in writing that her classes would transfer and that she would be done in 2 years with her degree. Lies, all lies, it took another 5 years for her to get her degree because they would not transfer half of her classes and then the program for her degree was set up on a 4 year program and would not work for transferees, the school would only offer the classes she needed for her degree in accordance with the 4 year schedule and would make no exceptions. They would not allow her to take the classes outside of the 4 year schedule in any way, shape or form. It is all about the money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 How the heck did you get 60 hours out of 5 classes? It took me something like 17 or 18 classes to get mine! 12 hours per class. Tons of writing. I still have anxiety attacks over all that writing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kat Posted January 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 HaHaHaHaHa, I have heard horror stories of those graduate classes. I didn't know you had yours AF, thats quite an acomplishment. I'm still waiting to hear some news from Jennifer B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted January 14, 2010 Report Share Posted January 14, 2010 HaHaHaHaHa, I have heard horror stories of those graduate classes. I didn't know you had yours AF, thats quite an acomplishment. . Accomplishment? Nah, just means I played the game and paid the tuition. BTW--I'm surprised you didn't notice my master's glow when you were visiting. :angel2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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