layin on the smackdown Posted December 28, 2010 Report Share Posted December 28, 2010 OK, so i have had my CVA Optima for a year and a half now, and have harvested one deer with it, over probably 6 shots, of which one was this year on a giant 10 ptr that i missed. I know this gun is a super accurate rifle, and i have proven that to myself every time i shoot it on targets with a rest...My problem is, i cant hit crap shooting this thing free hand...I am shooting 223 grain power belts with 100 grains of powder, and off the bench she's lethal out to 225 yds (in terms of consistent accuracey)... So, i had a friend of mine tell me to max my power out (ithink its 10 on the powderhorn scope), sight it in at 30 yds with my bullet hole 3 inches high...So being the idiot i am, thats what i did, and the target looked like it was the size of a dang barn, but it was dialed and i thought it was solid...So i have 155 inch 10 ptr give me a shot at 75 yds, i let her bark, the smoke clears and the damn deer is standing there is if it knew that i knew that it knew the game was over....What happened? Sure, his body took up the entire scope, and my crosshairs weren't exaclty steady, but i was on him...heck i can hit a lawn mower at 75 yds with anything, and i clearly missed this buck... What should i be sighting this scope in at in terms of power...There is no way i will ever have a shot over 150 yds where i hunt.... And yes, there is plenty of room for operator error, unfortunately... Thanks dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted December 28, 2010 Report Share Posted December 28, 2010 Any delay in ignition? Are you maybe pulling the trigger down or right with the freestanding form? Have you tried freestanding practice shooting? Usually site in with our guns with the scope in the 4-6 range for 100 yards. Do dial them up when shooting longer ranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnatecsteve Posted December 29, 2010 Report Share Posted December 29, 2010 Are you sighting in with cold barrel? Alot of people dont think much about the conditions of the gun when they are sighting in. Its usually in the warmer months and they take two or three shots, make an adjustment, take another two or three. All of this time the barrel is staying warm. Now, load up and take the gun out in late December when its maybe in the twenties, get that barrel nice and cold, then see where it hits. Just like those telephone lines shrink up in the cold, so does your barrel, thus increasing velocity due to a much tighter seal on the bullet. Just my guess, but you might want to take a shot off the bench with a cold barrel and see what you get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbHunterNY Posted December 29, 2010 Report Share Posted December 29, 2010 something loosened up or there's operator error (normally my case). as what's been said, maybe try shooting free hand at the range and see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goinghuntin Posted December 31, 2010 Report Share Posted December 31, 2010 Usually site in with our guns with the scope in the 4-6 range for 100 yards. Do dial them up when shooting longer ranges. That's exactly how I sighted my gun in. I however had the same problem as you have Smackdown, I kept missing deer that were easy shots. 3 out of 4 misses were probably on me but I should have tagged them all. Still haven't figured out why, but it all worked out in the end when I shot a decent buck at 75 yards. Nathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted December 31, 2010 Report Share Posted December 31, 2010 Might want to invest in a shooting stick or a bi/tripod of some sort. I love mine, gives you a rock steady platform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earnhardts12000 Posted December 31, 2010 Report Share Posted December 31, 2010 i missed 4 with my optima too i don't understand it either was at 50 yrds puttin 2 through same hole even usin shootin sticks still nothing i am using 250 grain tc shockwaves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrontierGander Posted December 31, 2010 Report Share Posted December 31, 2010 ok, you shoot like a rabbit on crack with the gun off a rest but cant hit a barn while off hand shooting.... Whats the problem? You just answered it yourself. Its not the gun, its your lack of off hand shooting skills. How do we improve on that? Practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebohio Posted December 31, 2010 Report Share Posted December 31, 2010 do you fire a couple of caps before you load your gun? it will dry out any oils or cleaning solvents left in your barrel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted January 1, 2011 Report Share Posted January 1, 2011 do you fire a couple of caps before you load your gun? it will dry out any oils or cleaning solvents left in your barrel. Yep. I know the first shot through my Encore will shoot way high if I don't run a patch down the barrel to get the bore butter out of there before I shoot. The second shot is usually a little high too. I've read that a lot of barrels shoot more accurately if they are a little fouled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolybear Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 I had a buddy that got his ML all sited in fine and dandy then missed his first shot at a buck. He came over to shoot and couldn't even get the thing on paper anymore off a rest. We swapped guns for a few shots with the same results but I was hitting fine with his. After watching his next few shots it was obvious just before he fired that he was pulling his face off the stock for whatever reason and peeking around the scope with his left eye and pushing the barrel right......I only assume it was to try to see around the anticipated smoke cloud and "watch" his bullets flight.:wacko: After we figured that may be the problem and worked to correct it he started out shooting me. Just throwing that out there. May be something to pay attention to next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 I had a buddy that got his ML all sited in fine and dandy then missed his first shot at a buck. He came over to shoot and couldn't even get the thing on paper anymore off a rest. We swapped guns for a few shots with the same results but I was hitting fine with his. After watching his next few shots it was obvious just before he fired that he was pulling his face off the stock for whatever reason and peeking around the scope with his left eye and pushing the barrel right......I only assume it was to try to see around the anticipated smoke cloud and "watch" his bullets flight.:wacko: After we figured that may be the problem and worked to correct it he started out shooting me. Just throwing that out there. May be something to pay attention to next time. Real good point there on follow through there Matt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tominator Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 After watching his next few shots it was obvious just before he fired that he was pulling his face off the stock for whatever reason and peeking around the scope with his left eye and pushing the barrel right......I only assume it was to try to see around the anticipated smoke cloud and "watch" his bullets flight.:wacko: . Great point. You could play "ball and dummy" with him. I did that to my son when he was sighting in back in November. Load the gun as you normally would, then take the gun, don't let your buddy see it, then load a cap, or don't load a cap, then hand it to him. When he drops the hammer on an empty nipple, you'll see if he flinches or doesn't follow through. Do that 5 or 6 times and I'd almost guarantee he'll be cured. I did that to my son and was floored the first time he dropped the hammer on an empty chamber. He didn't move a muscle. :jaw: :tt1: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETMGROW Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 I'd like to throw a new twist into this discussion. I do not hunt with a fouled barrel. Makes no sense to me at all. I am not planning to shoot a deer everytime I go out. I am not going to leave residue in my barrel for any length of time. Therefore, I sight my MZ in with a CLEAN barrel each and every shot! This leads to consistency. Lots of work, but well worth the effort. Something many shooters don't allow for is the constant buildup of plastic from saboted bullets. This can be remidied by using a cleaner like Brownell's sabot cleaner. Give this a try. Lynn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layin on the smackdown Posted January 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 Thanks everyone for the replies and advice...I think we have a combination of problems that i am dealing with. First and foremost, i am pretty sure i am jerking the gun when i am shooting at deer, probably for the reasoning above, so i can see if i hit it after the shot, but its not intentional, it seems to be like a quick reaction maybe...Who knows...I dont jerk at all when dialing it in, but i think this may be different when firing a round at a deer...As far as cleaning the barrel, i do it after every shot - i usually run those saturated cloth pads through the barrel until they come up clean, usually takes 4-5, then i'll load and fire another round (the only time i havent done this is in the woods when i thought i may need a quick second shot). Lastly, i honestly think i just need way more practice...Its one thing to shoot paper targets all day off a rest, but when youre up to bat, and its the real deal - rest or no rest - i seem to feel alot more pressure...Don't know why, probably a huge lack of experience with shooting a scope as this is the only gun i own that i have a scope on. Thanks again everyone, and i'll definitely try some of your suggestions. dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhunt Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 Lastly, i honestly think i just need way more practice...Its one thing to shoot paper targets all day off a rest, but when youre up to bat, and its the real deal - rest or no rest - i seem to feel alot more pressure...Don't know why, probably a huge lack of experience with shooting a scope as this is the only gun i own that i have a scope on. Thanks again everyone, and i'll definitely try some of your suggestions. dan Sounds like a real good excuse to shoot lots more to me. Good time to hit the wal mart clearance aisles for leftovers Dan. Sometimes you can really luck up on powder and sabots this time of year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETMGROW Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 You might try shooting a .22 for some practice. This could be a great way to learn not to look around the shot. Flinching can be kept under control. I understand this is not the gun you are having trouble with but you can learn better technique a lot more cheaply. While you are shooting the .22, pick up the mz. and shoot it once in a while. This way you can see what you are or aren't doing differently. There will be alot less cleaning involved also. Sounds like you are sorting things out. Practice will give you the confidence and control you need. Good Luck, Lynn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PA_RIDGE_RUNNER Posted January 5, 2011 Report Share Posted January 5, 2011 Shooting at real game is never like shooting off a bench. We are excited and thinking crazy thoughts and our shooting is not the same as at the range. I like the shooting sticks idea and in lieu of that a tree also makes a fair stabilizer. Once the crosshairs are on the animal make every attempt to squeeze the trigger. A jerked trigger absolutely destroys accuracy. I have a ritual I follow when shooting at the range. 1 swab the bore followed by two dray patches. 2 go forward to check the target 3 reload the rifle 4 shoot again. This keeps the barrel relatively cool and the bore relatively clean. Both are necessary when hunting because the barrel will always be cold and I do not like to hunt with a fouled barrel so I sight in on a clean barrel. Yes it takes time but reduces the missed shot to the operator. If I ever get to the point that I do not get excited at the shot at a deer I will quit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSmoke Posted January 8, 2011 Report Share Posted January 8, 2011 "misses" I don't like the idea of someone else loading my rifles for me to shoot, but snapping on a dry chamber is a great way to check for flinching. Put a cap on the nipple though or the nipple will be damaged by a dry fire. I would have someone pretend to load the rifle and hand it back to me with just a cap on the nipple. Second comment is to try some shooting sticks when you hunt. Third comment, and this will probably get me into trouble, is to try a different bullet. I have shot Powerbelts before, and they shoot fine, but there are MANY comments in the blogs about Powerbelts not opening up and/or leaving little or no blood trails. You may have hit those deer and had no blood trail to follow. I would suggest switching to one of the Barnes bullets and see how they work for you. They DO expand and are an excellent bullet. You won't find anyone bitching about the performance of a Barnes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETMGROW Posted January 9, 2011 Report Share Posted January 9, 2011 I don't like the idea of someone else loading my rifles for me to shoot, but snapping on a dry chamber is a great way to check for flinching. Put a cap on the nipple though or the nipple will be damaged by a dry fire. I would have someone pretend to load the rifle and hand it back to me with just a cap on the nipple. Second comment is to try some shooting sticks when you hunt. Third comment, and this will probably get me into trouble, is to try a different bullet. I have shot Powerbelts before, and they shoot fine, but there are MANY comments in the blogs about Powerbelts not opening up and/or leaving little or no blood trails. You may have hit those deer and had no blood trail to follow. I would suggest switching to one of the Barnes bullets and see how they work for you. They DO expand and are an excellent bullet. You won't find anyone bitching about the performance of a Barnes. This is a good point. Are you absolutely sure you missed every time? Last MZ season my son shot at a doe 75 yds. from his stand. I was a couple hundred yards away and had clean view of deer he was looking at. When the shot rang out I saw three deer run away all with their tails straight up. None looked hurt at all. I thought I'd been watching three deer in front of him but I remarked to my wife sitting along side me, there must have been four. I was sure of this because my son is a very competent shooter. Especially from his stand with a good rail rest. There had to be a dead deer in front of him. We exited my blind, walked over to see what was going on and my son said, " there is no way I missed that deer". I agreed and we started looking for signs of a hit. Knowing where the deer went, we criss crossed the route they took. We traveled about 125 yards before we found a small spot of blood. As we followed the blood trail, which had spots about 20-25 feet apart and hardly larger than the head of a pin we were amazed the deer hadn't " dropped in it's tracks ". We finally caught up with the deer and she was just standing there obviously mortally wounded but still alive on her feet. It was about 10 minutes after legal shooting hours so we elected reluctantly to back out and let her expire in peace. After about an hour we returned to find her dead right where we had last seen her. As it turned out, a piece of lung had plugged the exit hole as perfectly as could be. The point I am making is this: Never doubt your shot. Look until you are absolutely sure you did or didn't hit your target. The old fallicy, deer which have been hit, always drop their tails is bogus. Have confidence in the shooter until you have proved otherwise. Lynn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierbuck Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Observation-OP is genuinely appreciative of the suggestions and willing to work on deficiencies. EXCELLENT! Many good suggestions without being rude or condescending. EXCELLENT! This thread makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. HB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWSmith Posted January 11, 2011 Report Share Posted January 11, 2011 Observation-OP is genuinely appreciative of the suggestions and willing to work on deficiencies. EXCELLENT! Many good suggestions without being rude or condescending. EXCELLENT! This thread makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. HB Good Point..."Warm and Fuzzy" Nobody has suggested something that can almost imitate the "When your up to bat and it's the real deal...I seem to feel alot more pressure" feeling! All good suggestions for sure, I use many of them myself, but one that helped me deal with "Fur Fever Aiming Issues" when the moment of truth arrived was to run in place then shoot for practice. Load the ML and have it ready on the bench. Run in place for 30seconds or so then try to shoot the target. Get your heart rate up and your breathing faster...definitely will teach you to get on target before pulling the trigger. Also practice the way you hunt...if your hunting and presented with off-hand shots...thats the practice you should be doing, with all of your hunting gear/clothes on too. You'll find out what gets in the way that your not noticing when your seeing a deer but it wont cost you one;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETMGROW Posted January 12, 2011 Report Share Posted January 12, 2011 Observation-OP is genuinely appreciative of the suggestions and willing to work on deficiencies. EXCELLENT! Many good suggestions without being rude or condescending. EXCELLENT! This thread makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. HB And, this is exactly the way it should be. We are supposed to be friends. If someone reaches out for help we should be ready to help them. Who knows, any one of us may need a little help or advice at any time. Lynn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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