spikekiller Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 I was reading down through some of the posts today and i read the thread by Darkarcher of Wales and how almost all hunting is but illegal there. That really got me to thinking how fortunate we have it here as hunters. I think we should remember this the next time we want to argue about things like compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about. I have been quilty of some of these these things but hope i never again take for granted the privilege we have in hunting and in living in the greatest country on Gods green earth. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! AMEN !! I think you put that in perspective, and needs not be elaborated on more... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ILBIGBUCKS Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! good point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BamaTrophyHunter Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! thats exactly right! I think everyone thata has hunted for awhile will probaly be guilty just as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrincker Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! You got it, Times change and so do the bows, You dont see people arguing about gettin minimum wage raised everything is constantly evolving, but well put. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! makes you think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Oneshot7 Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! finally we have a post about this thanks man can i get another AMEN!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckee Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! Yeah, we all need a slap in the head once in a while John. Thanks and again, welcome back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Chief Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! Well put. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dg Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! I missed three hunting seasons due to being stationed in England. I don't take it for granted anymore. I've had it taken away and it doesn't feel good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] I was reading down through some of the posts today and i read the thread by Darkarcher of Wales and how almost all hunting is but illegal there. That really got me to thinking how fortunate we have it here as hunters. I think we should remember this the next time we want to argue about things like compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about. I have been quilty of some of these these things but hope i never again take for granted the privilege we have in hunting and in living in the greatest country on Gods green earth. John [/ QUOTE ] I guess I really don't get the connection. Just because some countries have knuckled under to the anti-hunting forces, I don't really see why that should define what our discussions are here. If the inference is that because we take on some controversial topics here that somehow this is going to cause anti forces to succeed in the US, I completely disagree with that. The basics of hunting legality are still something that we all agree on, and I'm sure we are in complete unity on that score regardless of how we feel about the topics you listed. One thing that I feel very strongly about is that fear of anti-hunting organizations should not set the agenda for any of the discussions that we have here. Also, I believe that the very purpose of hunting forums is to discuss even the things that we might disagree about. Further, having some of these spirited debates on here are useful in clarifying our own arguments with the animal rights people. It doesn't serve us well to only be familiar with one side of hunting issues (our own personal side). Understanding exactly why someone may disagree with some aspect of hunting is very useful in giving you a heads-up when discussing the issue with anti-hunters or non-hunters. I will tell you that I have had many non-hunters ask some of the same questions that I see on this forum. Having already seen the pros and cons on here or other forums, gave me a chance to answer them with clarity and understanding as well as being prepared for any follow-up points that they may have had. The problem on these hunting forums is not the topics or the fact that there may be some controversy to some of the topics. The biggest difficulty is that some lose complete control of how to express themselves. That's what should be worked on ..... not topic selection. Do not let the anti-hunting forces scare you out of honest hunting related discussions. This is our forum and not theirs, so let's be sure that it is us who are setting the tone and topics here, not the anti's. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I was reading down through some of the posts today and i read the thread by Darkarcher of Wales and how almost all hunting is but illegal there. That really got me to thinking how fortunate we have it here as hunters. I think we should remember this the next time we want to argue about things like compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about. I have been quilty of some of these these things but hope i never again take for granted the privilege we have in hunting and in living in the greatest country on Gods green earth. John [/ QUOTE ] I guess I really don't get the connection. Just because some countries have knuckled under to the anti-hunting forces, I don't really see why that should define what our discussions are here. If the inference is that because we take on some controversial topics here that somehow this is going to cause anti forces to succeed in the US, I completely disagree with that. The basics of hunting legality are still something that we all agree on, and I'm sure we are in complete unity on that score regardless of how we feel about the topics you listed. One thing that I feel very strongly about is that fear of anti-hunting organizations should not set the agenda for any of the discussions that we have here. Also, I believe that the very purpose of hunting forums is to discuss even the things that we might disagree about. Further, having some of these spirited debates on here are useful in clarifying our own arguments with the animal rights people. It doesn't serve us well to only be familiar with one side of hunting issues (our own personal side). Understanding exactly why someone may disagree with some aspect of hunting is very useful in giving you a heads-up when discussing the issue with anti-hunters or non-hunters. I will tell you that I have had many non-hunters ask some of the same questions that I see on this forum. Having already seen the pros and cons on here or other forums, gave me a chance to answer them with clarity and understanding as well as being prepared for any follow-up points that they may have had. The problem on these hunting forums is not the topics or the fact that there may be some controversy to some of the topics. The biggest difficulty is that some lose complete control of how to express themselves. That's what should be worked on ..... not topic selection. Do not let the anti-hunting forces scare you out of honest hunting related discussions. This is our forum and not theirs, so let's be sure that it is us who are setting the tone and topics here, not the anti's. Doc [/ QUOTE ] I think his point was fairly clear...why argue over trivial topics, when ALL forms of hunting should be appreciated from the same platform, and that platform is a simple one...the fact that we can participate in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! Doc I don’t think John’s post was meant to imply that we should not discuss whatever hunting related topics we want. I read it simply as “lets keep in mind that hunting is a privilege we have that some other countries have taken away or limited”. I agree that we should always keep that in mind and continue to work to protect that privilege but I also agree with you that we should never let antis dictate what hunting related topics we wish to discuss in this forum created for hunters. The main reason I joined this forum was to try to pass along some of my 30+ years of hunting experience in the hope that I might save someone from learning something hunting related the hard way like I did. A hunter’s most valuable weapon in the field is his brain. Also, I’ve benefited from picking up some helpful hints myself, along with being enlightened just how different hunting situations are around this country and Canada. Thanks John for the reminding all of us not to take our privilege to hunt for granted bud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randyman Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I was reading down through some of the posts today and i read the thread by Darkarcher of Wales and how almost all hunting is but illegal there. That really got me to thinking how fortunate we have it here as hunters. I think we should remember this the next time we want to argue about things like compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about. I have been quilty of some of these these things but hope i never again take for granted the privilege we have in hunting and in living in the greatest country on Gods green earth. John [/ QUOTE ] I guess I really don't get the connection. Just because some countries have knuckled under to the anti-hunting forces, I don't really see why that should define what our discussions are here. If the inference is that because we take on some controversial topics here that somehow this is going to cause anti forces to succeed in the US, I completely disagree with that. The basics of hunting legality are still something that we all agree on, and I'm sure we are in complete unity on that score regardless of how we feel about the topics you listed. One thing that I feel very strongly about is that fear of anti-hunting organizations should not set the agenda for any of the discussions that we have here. Also, I believe that the very purpose of hunting forums is to discuss even the things that we might disagree about. Further, having some of these spirited debates on here are useful in clarifying our own arguments with the animal rights people. It doesn't serve us well to only be familiar with one side of hunting issues (our own personal side). Understanding exactly why someone may disagree with some aspect of hunting is very useful in giving you a heads-up when discussing the issue with anti-hunters or non-hunters. I will tell you that I have had many non-hunters ask some of the same questions that I see on this forum. Having already seen the pros and cons on here or other forums, gave me a chance to answer them with clarity and understanding as well as being prepared for any follow-up points that they may have had. The problem on these hunting forums is not the topics or the fact that there may be some controversy to some of the topics. The biggest difficulty is that some lose complete control of how to express themselves. That's what should be worked on ..... not topic selection. Do not let the anti-hunting forces scare you out of honest hunting related discussions. This is our forum and not theirs, so let's be sure that it is us who are setting the tone and topics here, not the anti's. Doc [/ QUOTE ] I think his point was fairly clear...why argue over trivial topics, when ALL forms of hunting should be appreciated from the same platform, and that platform is a simple one...the fact that we can participate in them. [/ QUOTE ] I AGREE! If we don't hang together, we'll surely hang alone! Debate is fine, as long as we remember we are all in this together. I agree we shouldn't let the Anti's set the agenda, but don't forget, they love nothing more than to watch us fight amongst ourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PAT_PATTERSON Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! The problem on these hunting forums is not the topics or the fact that there may be some controversy to some of the topics. The biggest difficulty is that some lose complete control of how to express themselves. That's what should be worked on ..... not topic selection. Do not let the anti-hunting forces scare you out of honest hunting related discussions. This is our forum and not theirs, so let's be sure that it is us who are setting the tone and topics here, not the anti's. Doc I couldn't agree more... and I also agree we should be somewhat ashamed of how we treat other hunters and their choices. We are a diverse group of people with one common bond Hunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VermontHunter Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] Doc I don’t think John’s post was meant to imply that we should not discuss whatever hunting related topics we want. I read it simply as “lets keep in mind that hunting is a privilege we have that some other countries have taken away or limited”. I agree that we should always keep that in mind and continue to work to protect that privilege but I also agree with you that we should never let antis dictate what hunting related topics we wish to discuss in this forum created for hunters. The main reason I joined this forum was to try to pass along some of my 30+ years of hunting experience in the hope that I might save someone from learning something hunting related the hard way like I did. A hunter’s most valuable weapon in the field is his brain. Also, I’ve benefited from picking up some helpful hints myself, along with being enlightened just how different hunting situations are around this country and Canada. Thanks John for the reminding all of us not to take our privilege to hunt for granted bud. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I think his point was fairly clear...why argue over trivial topics, when ALL forms of hunting should be appreciated from the same platform, and that platform is a simple one...the fact that we can participate in them. [/ QUOTE ] BINGO !!,,,,, I couldn't agree more with these 2 statements..... It shouldn't be hunters against hunters, but rather hunters helping hunters.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! I just really hate these implications that hunters have anything that they could discuss that would have any negative impact on the well-being of hunting. That is just simply selling short the dedication of hunters toward their sport. Why is it that some of you have such a low impression of the ability of hunters as a group being able to have hard discussions on difficult subjects. Why do you automatically assume that because one guy disagrees with another on some point that all of a sudden he is not going to join a unified front against any attack on the sport? Do you all believe that hunting is so fragile that it cannot withstand some internal scrutiny and self-study? I'm sorry, but I have much more faith and respect for the sport and the individuals in it than that. I have yet to see a topic that has fractured our resolve against the anti-hunting movement. And no, it is not true that "we should be ashamed" about discussing "things like compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about". These are all legitimate topics and it is healthy to air out opinions in these areas. And, no there is not a one of these topics that run any risk of disunity when it comes to threats against hunting. You may disagree with the way opinions are presented, but a chill goes through me when anyone suggests that there are things in hunting that we feel we should keep quiet about. One of the things I admire most about hunters as a group is their ability to express opinions on any hunting related subject with a freedom of openess and honesty. And any time someone feels "ashamed" because they have, in a civil manner, posted or participated in some topic that they honestly have an opinion about, that is the time when we really better start worrying about the health of our hunting, because in reality what we are saying is that there are things in hunting that we are vulnerable against. And things that we dare not discuss. That is simply not true. There is nothing in any part of hunting that I am not willing to discuss in a sane and civil fashion. I'll leave the dishonesty and hiding of facts to the anti crowd. Furthermore, I just know that the same person I may have been debating on one of these controversial subjects will be right there along side of me when the anti-hunters start up one of their assaults. No, there is absolutely no link between forum topic selection and the lack of hunting priviledges in some other country. There is no connection whatever. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggs Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! Doc, I'm still a little unclear of what your point is, can you go into a little more detail? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stsi36 Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikekiller Posted March 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] Doc I don’t think John’s post was meant to imply that we should not discuss whatever hunting related topics we want. I read it simply as “lets keep in mind that hunting is a privilege we have that some other countries have taken away or limited”. I agree that we should always keep that in mind and continue to work to protect that privilege but I also agree with you that we should never let antis dictate what hunting related topics we wish to discuss in this forum created for hunters. The main reason I joined this forum was to try to pass along some of my 30+ years of hunting experience in the hope that I might save someone from learning something hunting related the hard way like I did. A hunter’s most valuable weapon in the field is his brain. Also, I’ve benefited from picking up some helpful hints myself, along with being enlightened just how different hunting situations are around this country and Canada. Thanks John for the reminding all of us not to take our privilege to hunt for granted bud. [/ QUOTE ] Thanks Rhino...you summed up what my point was. If arguing about these type of things is not a problem Why is there a sticky thread at the top of this forum called "Zero tolerance for brand bashing"? I have no problem with a healthy debate...but there are guys that will just want to always be right and thats it. The last thing we need is fighting within the ranks. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhino Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] If arguing about these type of things is not a problem Why is there a sticky thread at the top of this forum called "Zero tolerance for brand bashing"? John [/ QUOTE ] Good point John...you were fortunate to miss that mess. I'll just say it was necessary and very much appreciated for iminrut to put his foot down about that. Sometimes silly things like that issue can get pretty ugly. For more info PM iminrut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PAT_PATTERSON Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! One of the things that bow hunters have that a lot of other hunters don't have, is passion. Sometimes that passion spills over into these forums and sometimes it gets out of hand. I will debate any subject until someone gets ugly and starts name calling and telling me I am wrong and they are right because they say so. A debate is like a big tree, with me on one side and you on the other. You see what is on your side and I see what is on mine and both are different, but it's still the same tree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikekiller Posted March 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If arguing about these type of things is not a problem Why is there a sticky thread at the top of this forum called "Zero tolerance for brand bashing"? John [/ QUOTE ] Good point John...you were fortunate to miss that mess. I'll just say it was necessary and very much appreciated for iminrut to put his foot down about that. Sometimes silly things like that issue can get pretty ugly. For more info PM iminrut. [/ QUOTE ] Actually I saw things like that coming a long time ago its one of the reasons i took a sabbatical. I agree it looks like iminrut did a great job of handling it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! You guys are all talking about the way arguments are presented, not the topics themselves. I have already said that that is a valid point (several times already, in fact). The point I am getting at is that the original post by Spikekiller implied that there were several topics (and he listed some of those as "compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about" That would eventually bring about a situation here that would be similar to Wales where "almost all hunting is but illegal there". My response is that that simply is not true. I don't believe that their situation in Wales has anything to do with controversial discussions or disagreements. There are no topics on this or any forum that is realistically going to bring about that result. Further, I think that trying to stifle these topics along with any others that might be deemed "controversial" is really a bad thing for this forum and hunting in general. If there are people who think that hunting can't withstand discussions that involve anything that others may disagree with, then I simply, respectfully disagree. And to indicate that "we should be ashamed" at bringing up any subject that may contain any controversy, is just absurd. I really can't make it any clearer than that. Doc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossman Posted March 21, 2006 Report Share Posted March 21, 2006 Re: We should be ashamed!! [ QUOTE ] I was reading down through some of the posts today and i read the thread by Darkarcher of Wales and how almost all hunting is but illegal there. That really got me to thinking how fortunate we have it here as hunters. I think we should remember this the next time we want to argue about things like compounds/crossbows,trophy hunting/meat hunting,tradition/modern,brands of bows or the other stupid things we hunters argue about. I have been quilty of some of these these things but hope i never again take for granted the privilege we have in hunting and in living in the greatest country on Gods green earth. John [/ QUOTE ] I totally disagree!!!! What's wrong with a little discussion and/or argument every once in a while. Just because we sometimes disagree does not mean we don't respect each other. We have the freedoms to hunt and the freedom of speech!!! Were not all the same "robotic" people with the exact same views. So what if our views are different!!!! Having different views makes this forum interesting!!!! --rossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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